How to handle free estimates

[oscarcolumbo]

Just wondering how to handle estimates. Everyone wants a free estimate, and I don't mind giving an estimate on a big job, like a service change, a kitchen remodel or a generator install. Something big, I understand an estimate. But I'm getting tired of getting calls to drive 40 minutes to come give an estimate for something simple like adding two recessed cans. A lot of it is my fault for not saying no and telling them it will be time and materials, but how do you say that nicely so I don't lose the job. Just wondering what other people do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Ponchik]

Maybe you do want to lose the job or that client.

Consider taking a sales class so you learn how to handle potential clients that ask for FREE Estimates. www.contractorselling.com

 

[JFletcher]

How much is your time worth?

On the aforementioned 40 minute drive for two recessed cans, ask a few pertinent questions first, like:

How high up?
What is the ceiling made from?
Is there any furniture/staircases in the way?
Is the ceiling flat or sloped?
Is there overhead access?

Give a price over the phone. Even if you dont make a great profit on it, you've saved a 40 minute drive there, a 15-30 minute estimate, and a 40 minute drive back, a solid 2 hours labor and gas. If you dont get the job, no big loss right? If you get every estimate, your prices are probably too low.

After you do enough 'two can light' installs, you will be able to price over the phone or know off the top of your head how much time it takes and what materials will cost.

You dont have to say no. Just price the job based on worst case (takes an hour to get there, 3 to do the job, hour to get back). If your time is worth $125/hr, that's $525 plus materials, which would be ~$60 for two average recessed lights. If it's a ten minute drive and you can do it in two hours, then go by that.

We have a few places around here that just getting thru the contractor gate at 7:30-8:30AM can take almost half an hour. Yes, you bill for that. I didn't choose to own a home in a gated community and have Security Sam at the guard gate checking all credentials and what not like I'm driving onto Camp Peary. I didn't buy a house with 20' ceilings in the living room. If your customer did, they get to pay for those luxuries all over again when they want 'two can lights'.

There's not an EC in my area that would come here and give an estimate (free or otherwise) on a panel change at this place. Most will shoot a worst case (high) estimate at you over the phone. Free estimates for small jobs (4 hours or less) is largely a waste of time imho. You can always go high and give the customer a cheaper/lesser bill, but driving 2 hours to estimate a 2-3 hour job is not profitable imo.

 

[Ragin Cajun]

How much is your time worth?

On the aforementioned 40 minute drive for two recessed cans, ask a few pertinent questions first, like:

How high up?
What is the ceiling made from?
Is there any furniture/staircases in the way?
Is the ceiling flat or sloped?
Is there overhead access?

Give a price over the phone. Even if you dont make a great profit on it, you've saved a 40 minute drive there, a 15-30 minute estimate, and a 40 minute drive back, a solid 2 hours labor and gas. If you dont get the job, no big loss right? If you get every estimate, your prices are probably too low.

After you do enough 'two can light' installs, you will be able to price over the phone or know off the top of your head how much time it takes and what materials will cost.

You dont have to say no. Just price the job based on worst case (takes an hour to get there, 3 to do the job, hour to get back). If your time is worth $125/hr, that's $525 plus materials, which would be ~$60 for two average recessed lights. If it's a ten minute drive and you can do it in two hours, then go by that.

We have a few places around here that just getting thru the contractor gate at 7:30-8:30AM can take almost half an hour. Yes, you bill for that. I didn't choose to own a home in a gated community and have Security Sam at the guard gate checking all credentials and what not like I'm driving onto Camp Peary. I didn't buy a house with 20' ceilings in the living room. If your customer did, they get to pay for those luxuries all over again when they want 'two can lights'.

There's not an EC in my area that would come here and give an estimate (free or otherwise) on a panel change at this place. Most will shoot a worst case (high) estimate at you over the phone. Free estimates for small jobs (4 hours or less) is largely a waste of time imho. You can always go high and give the customer a cheaper/lesser bill, but driving 2 hours to estimate a 2-3 hour job is not profitable imo.

Excellent advice. Need to follow it myself.

RC

 

[Fulthrotl]

for something simple like adding two recessed cans. A lot of it is my fault for not saying no and telling them it will be time and materials, but how do you say that nicely so I don't lose the job. Just wondering what other people do.

they say... "why, yes, i'd like to help you."

how high is the ceiling? 8'? that would be $338.
you have six lights in that room? that would be $600.

the ceiling is 14'? every six feet higher doubles the price.
so... carry the two.... $678. six of them in that ceiling? $1,200.

those prices seem high? yes, they do, and thank you for noticing.
there is usually a wealth of entrepreneurs clustered in the home
desperate parking lot, and i'm sure your needs can be fulfilled there.

oh, you live in new porsche beach, or corona del misfit?
i'm sorry, that is outside my service range. by a long ways.

 

[growler]

how high is the ceiling? 8'? that would be $338.
you have six lights in that room? that would be $600.

the ceiling is 14'? every six feet higher doubles the price.
so... carry the two.... $678. six of them in that ceiling? $1,200.

those prices seem high? yes, they do, and thank you for noticing.

Actually I don't think those prices are high. If they want the lights installed by an EC. I have checked prices listed by other contractors and those are cheaper than many of them.

I tell people that I charge reasonable rates, I don't say they will consider them reasonable. You can't get cheap enough that people will actually like the prices. Six cans for $600 in an 8 ft. ceiling is reasonable ( if you do a professional job).

 

[petersonra]

Just wondering how to handle estimates. Everyone wants a free estimate, and I don't mind giving an estimate on a big job, like a service change, a kitchen remodel or a generator install. Something big, I understand an estimate. But I'm getting tired of getting calls to drive 40 minutes to come give an estimate for something simple like adding two recessed cans. A lot of it is my fault for not saying no and telling them it will be time and materials, but how do you say that nicely so I don't lose the job. Just wondering what other people do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

best way to handle free estimates is to charge for them.

 

[growler]

best way to handle free estimates is to charge for them.

In residential service many people won't pay for an estimate.

So as long as you don't have anything invested you may as well just jack up the price and give a phone estimate.

You don't get a high percentage of the jobs doing it this way but then you don't waste a lot of time and you haven't put 500 miles on a vehicle trying to bid jobs just to get one.

The truth is that within the first couple of minutes on the phone you can normally tell the tire kickers from those that actually want to get a job done and are willing to pay for it.

An estimate is not a confirmed price...it can go up.

 

[JFletcher]

In residential service many people won't pay for an estimate.

So as long as you don't have anything invested you may as well just jack up the price and give a phone estimate.

You don't get a high percentage of the jobs doing it this way but then you don't waste a lot of time and you haven't put 500 miles on a vehicle trying to bid jobs just to get one.

The truth is that within the first couple of minutes on the phone you can normally tell the tire kickers from those that actually want to get a job done and are willing to pay for it.

An estimate is not a confirmed price...it can go up.

:happyyes:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Even if one gets 50% jobs landed from estimates like this (in person), they are looking at ~6 hours invested to do a 3 hour job. If you charge $125 an hour for the work, you are making half that. If you charge $80 an hour and dont spend but 5 minutes on the phone landing the job, you are coming out way ahead. iow (in other words), it's better to land more jobs at a lower rate than waste a ton of time estimating small jobs (at a higher rate) you will likely never get. and yes, you will take a bath on one once in a while, it's the nature of the business. Taking a bath on two can lights may mean working until 7pm instead of 2pm. or coming back the next day... far better than burning say 20+ hours a week giving estimates in person to people who aren't serious or price shopping.

Actually I don't think those prices are high. If they want the lights installed by an EC. I have checked prices listed by other contractors and those are cheaper than many of them.

I tell people that I charge reasonable rates, I don't say they will consider them reasonable. You can't get cheap enough that people will actually like the prices. Six cans for $600 in an 8 ft. ceiling is reasonable ( if you do a professional job).

I dont think them high either. Especially the 'double price' every 6' up. Moving furniture and erecting (and renting) scaffolding isn't quick.

 

[Coppersmith]

The truth is that within the first couple of minutes on the phone you can normally tell the tire kickers from those that actually want to get a job done and are willing to pay for it.

Agreed.

If their first question is "do you give free estimates?" then you might as well hang up the phone right then. If you are giving proper prices based on making a fair profit, you will be too high for them.

If they never ask about price and at the end of the conversation you tell them what the fair price for that job is, they are likely to buy the job.

 

[Fulthrotl]

I dont think them high either. Especially the 'double price' every 6' up. Moving furniture and erecting (and renting) scaffolding isn't quick.

that 6' multiplier was something an old guy told me a long time ago,
and it's stood the test of time.

if you could run 500' of conduit chest high on a wall in a day,
you can do 250' on a six foot ladder, and 125' on a ten foot ladder.

12' ladders and and above, the milage drops way off...... :happysad:
heck, just looking at a little giant skyhook makes me want to
just get back in the van and hide.

"The SkyScraper is indeed the world's tallest a-frame ladder
with a maximum height of 21-feet, making ceiling-height
work simple and safe. The SkyScraper is perfect for
churches, auditoriums, gymnasiums and other industrial
applications."

sure, wilburrrr..... nothing about one of those ladders merits
the word "perfect".

 

[growler]

Agreed.

If their first question is "do you give free estimates?" then you might as well hang up the phone right then. If you are giving proper prices based on making a fair profit, you will be too high for them.

I don't just hang up on anyone. If they ask if I give free estimates I ask what the job is. If they say the are doing a basement finish then I ask if they have a set of plans that include the electrical. Normally they say no. So I ask for a run down on the job. So it's going to have a kithen, bath, heat pump, TV room, so on and so on plus 38 recessed cans.

I can do an estimate on this job and I schedule an appointment.

If they say it's two recessed cans I just say it's a minimum of $500 and odds are you will never hear from them again.

 

[James L]

everyone who says "yes" has to pitch in to pay for all the time you spent with everyone who says "no"

In other words, you simply cannot do a truly free estimate. All the time you spend giving those estimates has to be built into the prices you offer

 

[Mark A.]

I'm originally from Michigan, where there is no such thing as a free estimate, at least for residential. Every electrician charges for the trip and gives you a credit towards the work if you pick them.

Out here in Northern California, it seems like everyone has to give a free estimate as part of doing business. There are some ways to mitigate it, and we're trying various things all the time to do so, but it seems crazy.