Indoor unit

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jumper said:
Yeah and it was too much for even me to comment on and I got pretty low standards.

Just wait till someone wonders whether AFCI is needed for the circuit and it’s all over.

I am gonna go and see if I can find me a 208V high leg delta service to play with.....
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I seen it and commented on it.... just as well hold electrical class on this one.. :p

JAP>
 
jumper said:
Agreed, if the nameplate said one thing and the instructions another, nameplate rules without a doubt.

This whole thread started because there was no nameplate. Or later OP found it but had not said at beginning. Or was it that some info missing on the nameplate........

IDK, thread has gotten so muddled I have forgotten at this point.
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There is no nameplate. The drawings aee at design stage not yet permitted. There never was nameplate. Everything coming from engineering drawing which has not yet permitted.

Heck I dont know how nameplate got involved.

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codequestion said:
There is no nameplate. The drawings aee at design stage not yet permitted. There never was nameplate. Everything coming from engineering drawing which has not yet permitted.

Heck I dont know how nameplate got involved.

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I have no idea, my brain is fried on this one.

I gotta go, there is a large Starbucks double shot of espresso Vanilla flavored Iced Coffee calling my name and I need to answer......
 
jumper said:
Yeppers.
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Well follow up contacted the engineer who said whats wrong with 25amos it is sized per nec? I said contwct manufacturer and see what the mocp is and 25 amps maybe oversized.

He said in his 30 years of working as engineer no one has asked him to do.

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codequestion said:
Well follow up contacted the engineer who said whats wrong with 25amos it is sized per nec? I said contwct manufacturer and see what the mocp is and 25 amps maybe oversized.

He said in his 30 years of working as engineer no one has asked him to do.

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I suppose he can put whatever he wants as long as the conductors supplying the unit are sized properly. Also assuming that the manufacturer hasn't specified a max size for the OCPD. Which he should check. Not your job.
 
codequestion said:
Well follow up contacted the engineer who said whats wrong with 25amos it is sized per nec? I said contwct manufacturer and see what the mocp is and 25 amps maybe oversized.

He said in his 30 years of working as engineer no one has asked him to do.

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You could run a 25 amp circuit to a disconnect and then fuse the disconnect at 15 amps. If this is a commercial job, at least the engineers I deal with, always spec a fused disconnect at the unit.
 
Mgraw said:
You could run a 25 amp circuit to a disconnect and then fuse the disconnect at 15 amps. If this is a commercial job, at least the engineers I deal with, always spec a fused disconnect at the unit.
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Per post #73 the OP stated the engineer has drawn a 25 amp circuit to a 20a NF Disconnect.
I don't see how this could be since actual NF disconnects start a 30 amps.

Generally an engineer will draw a disconnect symbol on the prints and if it has a (20) beside it that means it should be a 30 amp fused disconnect fused at 20amps.

If this is actually the case, then the OP misread the print, since even it were indicated to be fused at 20 amps the change to a 15 amp fuse would not result in a price increase and no change order would be needed.

If this is a bid job and the engineer actually indicated the disconnect to be a "Non Fused" 20a disconnect, then a change order should be submitted to change the "Non Fused" disconnect to a 30 amp "Fused Disconnect" with 15 amp fuses and be done with it.

JAP>
 
Mgraw said:
You could run a 25 amp circuit to a disconnect and then fuse the disconnect at 15 amps. If this is a commercial job, at least the engineers I deal with, always spec a fused disconnect at the unit.
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Sounds like what one may expect in many cases. 25 amp supply covers worst case scenario, select fuse for actual equipment.

jap said:
If this is a bid job and the engineer actually indicated the disconnect to be a "Non Fused" 20a disconnect, then a change order should be submitted to change the "Non Fused" disconnect to a 30 amp "Fused Disconnect" with 15 amp fuses and be done with it.

JAP>
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I think many will just put in 15 amp breaker and be done with it, they do have to pass electrical inspection.
 
MAC702 said:
Lazy engineering by someone not paying for the materials.
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I do agree with that. Guy probably never got any unit details just went with worst case possible and designed for that. May even put in that section of plans before specific unit was selected.
 
kwired said:
I do agree with that. Guy probably never got any unit details just went with worst case possible and designed for that. May even put in that section of plans before specific unit was selected.
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Ok well maybe lazy but whats up with the engineers attitude no one really asked him that for 30 years. So he is putting 25 amps disconnect where manufacturer is recommending 15 amps and no AHJ caught it?

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Ok well maybe lazy but whats up with the engineers attitude no one really asked him that for 30 years. So he is putting 25 amps circuit breaker where manufacturer is recommending 15 amps and no AHJ caught it? That guy must really have good contractor who back in their mind says oh the engineer is being stupid agsin let me correct his mistakes.



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codequestion said:
Ok well maybe lazy but whats up with the engineers attitude no one really asked him that for 30 years. So he is putting 25 amps disconnect where manufacturer is recommending 15 amps and no AHJ caught it?

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I didn't see anywhere if it was asked, but is this a commercial or residential setup?
 
jap said:
Per post #73 the OP stated the engineer has drawn a 25 amp circuit to a 20a NF Disconnect.
I don't see how this could be since actual NF disconnects start a 30 amps.

Generally an engineer will draw a disconnect symbol on the prints and if it has a (20) beside it that means it should be a 30 amp fused disconnect fused at 20amps.

If this is actually the case, then the OP misread the print, since even it were indicated to be fused at 20 amps the change to a 15 amp fuse would not result in a price increase and no change order would be needed.

If this is a bid job and the engineer actually indicated the disconnect to be a "Non Fused" 20a disconnect, then a change order should be submitted to change the "Non Fused" disconnect to a 30 amp "Fused Disconnect" with 15 amp fuses and be done with it.

JAP>
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Typically here an engineer will spec a breaker size based on the unit the mechanical engineer spec'd. It is rare that the spec'd unit is actually installed. If say a carrier abc unit is spec'd but a trane dealer gets the job then the engineer may accept trane xyz for the job. Usually the bid specs will say carrier abc or comparable unit.

I have not come across an engineer specifying what fuse size for a disconnect. They will spec breaker size but the fuse size is generally left to the electrical contractor
 
Mgraw said:
Typically here an engineer will spec a breaker size based on the unit the mechanical engineer spec'd. It is rare that the spec'd unit is actually installed. If say a carrier abc unit is spec'd but a trane dealer gets the job then the engineer may accept trane xyz for the job. Usually the bid specs will say carrier abc or comparable unit.

I have not come across an engineer specifying what fuse size for a disconnect. They will spec breaker size but the fuse size is generally left to the electrical contractor
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Its not use he is sizing the breaker in panel.

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codequestion said:
Ok well maybe lazy but whats up with the engineers attitude no one really asked him that for 30 years. So he is putting 25 amps disconnect where manufacturer is recommending 15 amps and no AHJ caught it?

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Well 30 years ago that unit maybe was closer to truly needing 25 amp circuit then today;)

Did they really improve them that much? IDK, they may be more energy efficient, but I think they break down more then they used to which blows even bigger hole in the owner's checkbook then the inefficiency did.
 
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