Insulation piercing connector guidance needed

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Coppersmith

Coppersmith

Senior Member
Location
Tampa, FL, USA
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
jumper said:
Not to trying to be sarcastic but what do you think anyone here is going to reply to such?

We cannot say “sure, go ahead” and possibly get you killed.
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Just looking for some honesty. I suspect many people who install these do it hot as it saves having to pull the meter. I always prefer to turn off power before working, but I'm concerned I will be at a competitive disadvantage against contractors who work these hot. I just want to know where I stand.

(P.S. When I logged back on to see replies, I said to myself "let me see how much abuse I am getting." :))
 
LarryFine

LarryFine

Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
Location
Henrico County, VA
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
If I may respond...

I have used them when no other solution was viable. They can be installed hot but with no load on the tap. The bolts are isolated from the jaws.

Are they safe? I'm still here.
 
electrofelon

electrofelon

Senior Member
Location
Cherry Valley NY, Seattle, WA
Coppersmith said:
Just looking for some honesty. I suspect many people who install these do it hot as it saves having to pull the meter. I always prefer to turn off power before working, but I'm concerned I will be at a competitive disadvantage against contractors who work these hot. I just want to know where I stand.

(P.S. When I logged back on to see replies, I said to myself "let me see how much abuse I am getting." :))
Click to expand...

Why not just pull the meter? Seems that if you are doing a solar system, the utility knows work is going on, and probably will change out the meter anyway.. What's the worst case, you get scolded by the utility?
 
G

ggunn

PE (Electrical), NABCEP certified
Location
Austin, TX, USA
Occupation
Electrical Engineer - Photovoltaic Systems
electrofelon said:
Why not just pull the meter? Seems that if you are doing a solar system, the utility knows work is going on, and probably will change out the meter anyway.. What's the worst case, you get scolded by the utility?
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Or get fined, or have your inspection failed, or get removed from their list of approved contractors. Some utilities get very bent out of shape if you cut their tags.
 
J

jaggedben

Senior Member
Location
Northern California
Occupation
Solar and Energy Storage Installer
If you plan ahead you can get any utility to temporarily disconnect power, whether by pulling the meter or otherwise in the case of CT meters.

I think the harder issue to deal with is when the customer does not want a disruption of power.
 
Coppersmith

Coppersmith

Senior Member
Location
Tampa, FL, USA
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
electrofelon said:
Why not just pull the meter? Seems that if you are doing a solar system, the utility knows work is going on, and probably will change out the meter anyway.. What's the worst case, you get scolded by the utility?
Click to expand...

ggunn said:
Or get fined, or have your inspection failed, or get removed from their list of approved contractors. Some utilities get very bent out of shape if you cut their tags.
Click to expand...

electrofelon said:
I'm not saying there are no utilities where that happens, but in my experience, those policies are never enforced
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Everytime I do a panel change I pull the meter. None of the POCOs or inspectors have yelled at me yet. However it's not something I like doing due to inherent risk of fooling around with an unprotected feed. I always suit up in full arc flash gear to pull and reinsert the meter. Since it adds time to the job, I was wondering if there was a way to avoid it. I'm pretty sure my competitors are avoiding it.
 
Coppersmith

Coppersmith

Senior Member
Location
Tampa, FL, USA
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
jaggedben said:
If you plan ahead you can get any utility to temporarily disconnect power
Click to expand...

The POCO I deal with most often only does shutdowns Tues, Weds, and Thurs. They claim they will show up by 8am but it usually ends up being 10am. And if I don't call them by 3:30pm, they won't turn it back on that day. All of this adds up to a big inconvenience for doing a one day panel job.
 
electrofelon

electrofelon

Senior Member
Location
Cherry Valley NY, Seattle, WA
Pulling a meter is not zero risk, but imo less than tapping into live conductors. Another option, if you are comfortable with it is to pull the cutout with a hot stick. There are some members on here that have and use one on occasions.
 
G

ggunn

PE (Electrical), NABCEP certified
Location
Austin, TX, USA
Occupation
Electrical Engineer - Photovoltaic Systems
electrofelon said:
I'm not saying there are no utilities where that happens, but in my experience, those policies are never enforced
Click to expand...
My experience differs. Austin Energy, CPS (San Antonio), and some of the smaller AHJ's do enforce their policy regarding cut meter tags, and some of them make a big deal of it.
 
G

ggunn

PE (Electrical), NABCEP certified
Location
Austin, TX, USA
Occupation
Electrical Engineer - Photovoltaic Systems
Coppersmith said:
Everytime I do a panel change I pull the meter. None of the POCOs or inspectors have yelled at me yet. However it's not something I like doing due to inherent risk of fooling around with an unprotected feed. I always suit up in full arc flash gear to pull and reinsert the meter. Since it adds time to the job, I was wondering if there was a way to avoid it. I'm pretty sure my competitors are avoiding it.
Click to expand...
A panel change is, of course, a whole 'nother matter.
 
ptonsparky

ptonsparky

Tom
Location
NE (9.06 miles @5.9 Degrees from Winged Horses)
Occupation
EC - retired
Coppersmith said:
I've been asked to do a job installing a supply side tap for a PV system. The spec calls for using the product below or similar:

https://commerce.ilsco.com/e2wShoppingCatalog.aspx?parentId=3100012894&parentLink=2100001183

I've never installed one of these. Can it be installed hot? Is it safe to do so? Is the bolt insulated from the wire?
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I’ve used them in the past. I’m alive, but rules change. Sole proprietor? Go for it. An employer to an employee? Probably not.
 
gadfly56

gadfly56

Senior Member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Professional Engineer, Fire & Life Safety
electrofelon said:
Why not just pull the meter? Seems that if you are doing a solar system, the utility knows work is going on, and probably will change out the meter anyway.. What's the worst case, you get scolded by the utility?
Click to expand...

The jaws come tumbling out of the can. That's the worst that can happen.
 
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