Is it time to widen resi. panel?

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Galt

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Wis.
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master electrician and refrigeration service tech.
I remember the first home requiring arc faults. I thought I would get better at it but I think we simply need more room. My vote is for 4 more inches.
 
Galt said:
I remember the first home requiring arc faults. I thought I would get better at it but I think we simply need more room. My vote is for 4 more inches.
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I have thought about that. Believe me, I am no fan of AFCI's but if they are required, I would support a panel redesign so it all doesn't look some some poorly designed after thought. Square D's are the worst. Other brands don't see to take up nearly as much space, not sure what extra goodies SQ D puts in theirs that they need all that space.

Edit: You are free to use a true panelboard if you want, 20" wide!
 
electrofelon said:
I have thought about that. Believe me, I am no fan of AFCI's but if they are required, I would support a panel redesign so it all doesn't look some some poorly designed after thought. Square D's are the worst. Other brands don't see to take up nearly as much space, not sure what extra goodies SQ D puts in theirs that they need all that space.

Edit: You are free to use a true panelboard if you want, 20" wide!
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They need to start putting plug on neutral on the true panelboards also.
 
Most homes have a basement here so framing isn't a problem. But I can move a stud if I have to.
 
I like the idea of wider panels or they can be redesigned to have all of the breakers in a single row offset to one side.
 
I try my best not to use 20/40 or other combo panels. With so many AFCI's required, they are no good any more. I never liked them much to begin with.
 
The company I work for installs Square D Homeline exclusively. We do mostly new houses and install tons of AFCI breakers every month. I don't like the size of Square D AFCI breakers but I have gotten used to installing them, and I can make up a panel full of AFCI's lickety split.
 
peter d said:
The company I work for installs Square D Homeline exclusively. We do mostly new houses and install tons of AFCI breakers every month. I don't like the size of Square D AFCI breakers but I have gotten used to installing them, and I can make up a panel full of AFCI's lickety split.
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Yeah thats what I usually use. I don't like the size of the afci's, but the plug on neutral makes up for it. Does anyone else have a plug on neutral system?
 
SceneryDriver said:
The CH plug-on neutral looks dandy, until I have to install the panel as a subpanel, due to a meter-main or ATS for instance. How then, to separate the grounds? No good place for the ground bar.


SceneryDriver
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Couldn't you just disconnect the jumper between the neutral bars and make one a ground bar?
 
jmellc said:
I try my best not to use 20/40 or other combo panels. With so many AFCI's required, they are no good any more. I never liked them much to begin with.
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Just because it is 20/40 doesn't mean you have to use tandems in it, but if you want to use 40 spaces you will need to get a real 40 circuit panel or a 30/40, 40/60, etc. I see they do now have 40/80 units also.

Coppersmith said:
Yes, but if all the plug-on neutral devices fit on one side of the panel, then there is no issue. No rule they have to be on both sides.

(And they will all be tight too :D)
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Last new house I did had too many AFCI/GFCI's to use only one side of the panel for just those.
 
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