Is this a violation

[electrofelon]

I'll give anyone $20 who can damage that cable with a ladder.

I'm pretty sure we don't have to assume that something like out of a John Wick movie is going to be happening in that garage.

 

[James L]

I'll give anyone $20 who can damage that cable with a ladder.

I'm pretty sure we don't have to assume that something like out of a John Wick movie is going to be happening in that garage.

Yup. Not gonna damage NM by leaning on it

 

[acin]

Looks like they tried to hit the studs with the staples. Wonder if there long enough with 5/8 sr?

 

[infinity]

I'll give anyone $20 who can damage that cable with a ladder.

I'm pretty sure we don't have to assume that something like out of a John Wick movie is going to be happening in that garage.

Yup, In my garage the #22 gauge garage door sensor cable is stapled all over the place, along the ceiling and down the wall. To date that has never been damaged either.

 

[retirede]

I'll give anyone $20 who can damage that cable with a ladder.

I'm pretty sure we don't have to assume that something like out of a John Wick movie is going to be happening in that garage.

Also consider the force vectors involved. The force exerted on the NM by the ladder will be a fraction of the person’s weight depending on the angle of the ladder.
And in the example pictured, it would be almost impossible to put a ladder there due to the garage door track in front of it.

 

[Knuckle Dragger]

How about just don't lean the ladder on the live wire.

My entire 18 year old tool shed is wired in NM.
Chain seas, rakes,shovels, crowbars, pikes, bow saws, weed wackers, etc. None of it has been subjected to physical damaged.
But when I wire a customer's shed it's typically in emt and metal flexible conduit.

 

[AC\DC]

Might be allowed in your area under specialty code.in Oregon off top of head 8’ is consider not subject to damage for nmb

 

[DrSparks]

Also consider the force vectors involved. The force exerted on the NM by the ladder will be a fraction of the person’s weight depending on the angle of the ladder.
And in the example pictured, it would be almost impossible to put a ladder there due to the garage door track in front of it.

Compression damage to copper wire is surprisingly easy to accomplish. You may not see the problem until years down the road when the damaged section heats up and fails due to metal fatigue.

Sent from my SM-A326U using Tapatalk

 

[ActionDave]

Compression damage to copper wire is surprisingly easy to accomplish. You may not see the problem until years down the road when the damaged section heats up and fails due to metal fatigue.

Sent from my SM-A326U using Tapatalk

So what are we to do about the coming apocalypse from all the wires stuffed in junction boxes, especially the ones behind a GFI receptacles?

 

[DrSparks]

So what are we to do about the coming apocalypse from all the wires stuffed in junction boxes, especially the ones behind a GFI receptacles?

Well I wouldn't put it to that extreme. A receptacle outlet is at the end of a circuit. A cable feeding a whole string of outlets potentially sees considerably more load.

Also stuffing an outlet is not the same as striking a cable with a sharp edge.

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[jim dungar]

Compression damage to copper wire is surprisingly easy to accomplish. You may not see the problem until years down the road when the damaged section heats up and fails due to metal fatigue.

In that case, I hope you don't step on any NM during the installation process.

 

[Hv&Lv]

Compression damage to copper wire is surprisingly easy to accomplish. You may not see the problem until years down the road when the damaged section heats up and fails due to metal fatigue.

So…
334.30 is setting us up for failure??

 

[infinity]

In that case, I hope you don't step on any NM during the installation process.

Just tightly driving in a staple compresses the conductors. A 20 oz. hammer and a metal staple will do more damage than a leaning ladder.

 

[jim dungar]

A 20 oz. hammer and a metal staple will do more damage than a leaning ladder.

I agree. It seems most examples given for possible NM damage are really incidental contact or not much more than it sees during installation.

 

[Fred B]

I agree. It seems most examples given for possible NM damage are really incidental contact or not much more than it sees during installation.

Most of the rules put in place to protect stupid people from doing dumb things that will hurt themselves or others, this is not limited to electrical installation requirements.
Some changes came about as a better understanding of risks or how things actually work. Look at KT, it worked for years and I've come across some that is still in use, or old romex with undersized ground conductor used for years as well, but as knowledge increased it was seen the safety concerns with them.
Other changes just to protect people from doing dumb stuff, like using the hair dryer in the shower, or the person that wants to continue using a damaged cord
Of course getting rid of all these extra rules could be used for population control and create a smarter society. "If common sense was so common, more people would have it."

 

[infinity]

The varying opinions in this thread show us why the ambiguities in the NEC should be rewritten or removed.

 

[Hv&Lv]

I can almost guarantee everyone on this forum has witnessed energized NM used as clothes hangers, tool rests, or used as something other than a means of carrying current conductor without any problems.
It’s tough stuff. It’s why it’s used so much.
Personally, I see no problem with the OP.

 

[Fred B]

I can almost guarantee everyone on this forum has witnessed energized NM used as clothes hangers, tool rests, or used as something other than a means of carrying current conductor without any problems.
It’s tough stuff. It’s why it’s used so much.
Personally, I see no problem with the OP.

But I've also seen where it had made a dangerous situation, sheathing torn open, conductor pulled from the box, etc. Not everyone has for instance a quality ladder in good condition. I've also seen where a GC in process of setting up a ladder that a sharp edge sliced into an NM sheathing that was exposed similar to above.

 

[jim dungar]

I've also seen where a GC in process of setting up a ladder that a sharp edge sliced into an NM sheathing that was exposed similar to above.

Is a slice in the sheath an unsafe condition? Can't it be repaired with just electrical tape?
I cannot think of more typical potential damage than what can be caused during installation by pulling around sharp corners, being hit with a hammer as described by infinity, or the countless other perils of a construction site.

 

[kwired]

IMO almost everyone goes way overboard with this "subject to physical damage". really guys, what on Earth is going to damage that cable especially at eight feet up? Hang a rake on it, lean a ladder against it I'm sure it's going to be just fine. The nec allows exposed NM, as long as it closely follows the surface, so I hate this interpretation that whenever it's run exposed, then it's subject to physical damage. Why did the code writers allow it be run on the surface then if whenever it's run on the surface its subject to physical damage and thus can't be run exposed..... ??

All that said, I do consider that pretty hack....

And that is where some these rules come from. Inspector learned earlier on that you should protect it because whoever he learned it from thought that way, which is a fine design decision but still not what code is really saying, so inspector maybe thinks it is the rule without ever reading deep enough to discover otherwise.

It says what it says not what you think it says.

Charlies rule hasn't been mentioned in a while that I am aware of.