Isn't every inspector an instructor?

[dnem]

I have always made sure I knew what I needed to know before they arrived and in any cases had to educate them.

It's great when the installer knows more than me. . When somebody pulls out their code book and shows me something I didn't know, I'm better off for it.

I post alot of stuff on pool threads now, not because I'm smart, but because I was fortunate enough to be the inspector of many pools for a contractor that really had his act together. . He showed me using the code what I should be looking for by reading it from the NEC and then pointing it out in his own installation.

Now inspecting pools is easy for me, thanks to him.

OJT :smile:

David

 

[petersonra]

I agree but a little conversation in both direction eases any possible future issues.
Electrical inspector " You know it might be better if those conductors were in conduit in lieu of just slinging them over the racks."

Electrician 'Wow that's a neat idea I might try that next time"

Unless there is something wrong with just slinging them over the racks I think it is better for the inspector to just pass it.

It is different if a question is asked, but to give an opinion on what way among the sometimes dozens of ways to do things is "best" seems like the inspector is making design decisions.

 

[cowboyjwc]

Larry I have worked for several Municipalities and you are correct. Maybe thats why I have worked for several.....and soon to leave another.....They just do not care or stress education amongst the staff....way to complacent for me.

Wow that's sad. We have weekly code training in house every Thrusday. I am encourged to attend the the local IAEI meetings. The city pays for me to attend the Section meetings when they are in the state and also for the California Electrical Inspectors meetings once a year. They also send me to numorus seminars during the year. I am required by the state to have something like 57 CEU's every three years, I am usually in the 150+ CEU range every three years.

Larry, we must have crossed paths more than once over the years, I just can't figure out where. Are you going to
Monterey next month?

And to answer the original question, yes I believe we are, but I also believe that we are all students too.

 

[sandsnow]

Larry, we must have crossed paths more than once over the years, I just can't figure out where. Are you going to
Monterey next month?
QUOTE]

You may have seen me at the Downey or Anaheim meetings when the So Cal chapter meets. I wasn't there on the 16th. Just listen for City of Irvine.

 

[cowboyjwc]

Larry, we must have crossed paths more than once over the years, I just can't figure out where. Are you going to
Monterey next month?
QUOTE]

You may have seen me at the Downey or Anaheim meetings when the So Cal chapter meets. I wasn't there on the 16th. Just listen for City of Irvine.

Ahhh the old Russ Helmick kingdom. I'll keep my ears open.:smile:

 

[brantmacga]

Unless there is something wrong with just slinging them over the racks I think it is better for the inspector to just pass it.

It is different if a question is asked, but to give an opinion on what way among the sometimes dozens of ways to do things is "best" seems like the inspector is making design decisions.

exactly.

some of the older guys that used to be EC's will give me their 2 cents on how they did it (which somehow always seems to be a superior method), but unless I'm violating a code I really don't care unless they can show me an easier way to do something.


if an inspector shows me where i'm wrong, i will thank them for pointing it out and correct the error. i used to get a lot of opinionated inspections, and those that say "i want it like this because I said so." because trying to force me to do something can be like trying to tell a brick wall to move, i don't have the problem so much anymore. some guys will just let the inspectors walk over them just to avoid any hassle.
___________________________________

and pierre, don't get so bent out of shape over an off-handed remark.

 

[sandsnow]

i used to get a lot of opinionated inspections, and those that say "i want it like this because I said so." because trying to force me to do something can be like trying to tell a brick wall to move, i don't have the problem so much anymore.

We were taught to do that in the old days. I'm serious. No joke.

 

[cowboyjwc]

exactly.

some of the older guys that used to be EC's will give me their 2 cents on how they did it (which somehow always seems to be a superior method), but unless I'm violating a code I really don't care unless they can show me an easier way to do something.


if an inspector shows me where i'm wrong, i will thank them for pointing it out and correct the error. i used to get a lot of opinionated inspections, and those that say "i want it like this because I said so." because trying to force me to do something can be like trying to tell a brick wall to move, i don't have the problem so much anymore. some guys will just let the inspectors walk over them just to avoid any hassle.
___________________________________

and pierre, don't get so bent out of shape over an off-handed remark.

I think we get bent out of shape because for some reason everyone thinks that just because we became inspectors that we also became idiots.

I once watched a EC and his foreman discussing how much tile they were going to have to destroy in a bath room because the sconce was in the wrong place in a brand new house. I finally said why don't you just fix it from the hall side? Then all you have to repair is some drywall.

Yes I could have kept that to myself, because they make a lot more money than me and it's not a code issue and it was one of those, "that's the way I'd do it's", but I thought, hey, I've been in the trades for 30 years, maybe I could pass on a little something.

Now, I couldn't by code keep him from destroying all of that new tile, but he seemed like a decent enough guy, so I thought I'd try to help him out since the rest of the tract went so well.

 

[brantmacga]

I think we get bent out of shape because for some reason everyone thinks that just because we became inspectors that we also became idiots.

I once watched a EC and his foreman discussing how much tile they were going to have to destroy in a bath room because the sconce was in the wrong place in a brand new house. I finally said why don't you just fix it from the hall side? Then all you have to repair is some drywall.

Yes I could have kept that to myself, because they make a lot more money than me and it's not a code issue and it was one of those, "that's the way I'd do it's", but I thought, hey, I've been in the trades for 30 years, maybe I could pass on a little something.

Now, I couldn't by code keep him from destroying all of that new tile, but he seemed like a decent enough guy, so I thought I'd try to help him out since the rest of the tract went so well.

i didn't say all inspectors are idiots. to me, they're all qualified until they prove to me otherwise. i'd say 75% of the inspectors I deal w/ seem to know what they are doing. that number seems low, but could probably be applied to EC's that know what they're doing as well.

 

[wbalsam1]

.................
I once watched a EC and his foreman discussing how much tile they were going to have to destroy in a bath room because the sconce was in the wrong place in a brand new house. I finally said why don't you just fix it from the hall side? Then all you have to repair is some drywall.
................................................................................................

Now, I couldn't by code keep him from destroying all of that new tile, but he seemed like a decent enough guy, so I thought I'd try to help him out since the rest of the tract went so well.

I think this is great. I work like this a lot. It's in my nature.No one ever takes it wrong, because I am careful to make myself clear.
Remember this saying?:

The way to wealth is as plain as the way to market. It depends
chiefly on two words, industry and frugality; that is waste
neither time nor money, but make the best of both. Without
industry and frugality nothing will do; with them, everything.

Franklin

 

[Pierre C Belarge]

I was not offended by an 'offhanded' remark...there are plenty of them to go around on this site.

It was a stupid remark where someone stands behind anonymity of the site and says he is going to XXXXX an inspector when he comes on a site and he does not like what the inspector says.


Life will always be full of the ones who try to distract us from enjoying life.

 

[cowboyjwc]

i didn't say all inspectors are idiots. to me, they're all qualified until they prove to me otherwise. i'd say 75% of the inspectors I deal w/ seem to know what they are doing. that number seems low, but could probably be applied to EC's that know what they're doing as well.

And as inspectors, we could probably turn that whole statement around.

 

[brantmacga]

I was not offended by an 'offhanded' remark...there are plenty of them to go around on this site.

It was a stupid remark where someone stands behind anonymity of the site and says he is going to XXXXX an inspector when he comes on a site and he does not like what the inspector says.


Life will always be full of the ones who try to distract us from enjoying life.

anonymity? i've never tried to hide who I am on here. my name and city are listed right there. and i've told these things to the inspectors long before posting it on here.

its more than not liking what an inspector has to say. its when the inspector is wrong and tries to unjustly use his "authority" to take money out of my pocket.

 

[rook81108]

If quality work meets quality inspectors, tranquility ensues.

Remove or exaggerate anything in the list and the situation becomes chaotic, petty and selfish.

Tradesman are not all geniuses and where are many of the inspectors coming from?....

Focus on your work knowing that you have done your best and grow from every sucess and failure you and others make around you.

 

[dnem]

Tradesman are not all geniuses and where are many of the inspectors coming from?....

Yep, in Ohio you can't take the ESI test [Electrical Safety Inspector] to inspect for a government entity unless you have a minimum 5 documentable years in the field.

 

[TOOL_5150]

Just yesterday, I had to instruct an inspector on what a disconnect switch was. I ran a MWBC out to a shed, and used a square d 60a disconnect - its rated 60A max, it isnt a breaker. He told me he failed the job because the 60A 'breaker' wouldnt trip if the 20A mwbc got overloaded. I dont see why I have to do my job AND his... I shouldnt have to explain something that simple to someone who is paid to KNOW the code, or at least know how to look stuff up.

~Matt

 

[dnem]

Just yesterday, I had to instruct an inspector on what a disconnect switch was. I ran a MWBC out to a shed, and used a square d 60a disconnect - its rated 60A max, it isnt a breaker. He told me he failed the job because the 60A 'breaker' wouldnt trip if the 20A mwbc got overloaded. I dont see why I have to do my job AND his... I shouldnt have to explain something that simple to someone who is paid to KNOW the code, or at least know how to look stuff up.

~Matt

"it isnt a breaker"
Even if it was a breaker, that wouldn't make any difference. . You don't protect wires on their load end unless you have a service or a legit tap situation. . The load size needs a disconnect for the separate structure but if the disconnect also just happens to have OC ability, the trip size is irrelavant. . You can put a 20a breaker in building #1, 12gauge wire to building #2, and a 200a main breaker panel in building #2. . The 200a doesn't correspond with anything, nor does it need it.

Unfortunately I've run across inspectors that have suffered from that same confusion as your inspector does. . I think it has to do with seeing many outbuildings supplied with their own service. . We have to check the main breaker size against the supply wire size. . When you get a building to building feeder, checking the main breaker size against the supply wire size is done on autopilot.

I know I've had "hold-on-a-second" moments when I've seen little wire coming into a building and hitting a large breaker. . You have to "shift gears" and tell yourself that you're not looking at a service.

I've been told that my job walk is pretty good at picking-up on violations. . But my "filter" is set pretty high. . When I hear my violation "radar" going off, I stop and take a long look. . At least half of those times, I conclude that there is no violation. . Some inspectors are just too quick to grab their failed sticker. . I always assume that I'm missing something, when I see a violation [except with certain contractors]. . If I conclude that there is a violation, I assume that my finding will be challenged.

When in doubt, code book needs to come out.