Labor units for PVC in trench

Status
Not open for further replies.
I would install an underground jb at the 500' mark and use vacuum, string, mule tape and small rolls of wire. No way in HELL I would add jb's/splices and pull with a fish tape (are you KIDDING me?)

I'd lay the conduit in a pile (or one pile at each end), duct tape the end to keep out debris, have a helper walk it down as I added each piece. If I was working alone I would put togeter as much as I could. Depending on conditions this would be 100' t0 150', then drag them along side the trench and join them. WHATEVER you do, don't lay out 80 sticks of PVC along the trench.

I might pull the entire 800' if it made sense.

I might ignore 310.18 if it made sense.

Primer? pfffft. Primer is for pressurized water pipe 2" and over.

sometimes the string cuts right thru the pvc and creates nightmares
Click to expand...

A touch of watered down pre lube in the conduit works wonders.

At minimum, I'd figure 20 hours (2 guys, one day), 100% mark up on materials and I keep the leftover wire. I would add whatever I thought I could for whatever factors may be present ie: what's this job WORTH.

If I am on the job, all goes well and we will go home early. If I send someone else out, it may be a long day.
 
Mule said:
Here's a additional thought ......Alot of you guys seem to be very impacted by non payments and signing contracts, and I fully understand. But I just want to say Im very thankfull I live in a area, where generally speaking, a man's word and/or hand shake is pretty meaningfull. This particular customer just lost her husband a week ago, lives just down the road from my folks, Ive known her forever, and she would be offended if I asked her to sign....AND Further more.....Im the type that when Im working with people like this and my cost comes in under the quote, I revert to T/M and only charge for that......call me crazy....but thats just how I operate.
Click to expand...

That great, and I have customers that I feel the same way towards. It's the ones you do not know, the GC's or the ones you just get that feeling about that you need to KYA.
The program I use came in with this 6.66 man hours per 100' = 53.28
At $70.00 per hr it comes to $3729 Material at 1436 for a total of $5165
(material cost was based on 4 #10 stranded)
As you have stated you do not know all the info as to what you will need. I just did a job to a shed in a horse pasture, 570 feet for a 20 amp load I had to pull #6 and that footage was about max for the VD. I ran yours through the VD calc. At 120v 10 amp you would need #4 to stay in 5% vd. With 240 v 10amp you would need #6
 
ceb58 said:
That great, and I have customers that I feel the same way towards. It's the ones you do not know, the GC's or the ones you just get that feeling about that you need to KYA.
The program I use came in with this 6.66 man hours per 100' = 53.28
At $70.00 per hr it comes to $3729 Material at 1436 for a total of $5165
(material cost was based on 4 #10 stranded)
As you have stated you do not know all the info as to what you will need. I just did a job to a shed in a horse pasture, 570 feet for a 20 amp load I had to pull #6 and that footage was about max for the VD. I ran yours through the VD calc. At 120v 10 amp you would need #4 to stay in 5% vd. With 240 v 10amp you would need #6
Click to expand...

I apreciate all the help. The gate man called today and said he will most likely go with a 1hp AND he said it 650ft not 800.....geez Its probably a dual voltage motor, so I'll probably go with 240v with a neutral and egc as they she may want to add some lighting at later date. Then the customer also called today and stated that her plumber is going to do the trenching for free. I think I should install a surge protector or perhaps a lighting arrestor down there as well.

So with that 1hp and 650ft what does your vd calculator say?
 
growler said:
A contract is not just to make sure you can collect from dead beats. A proper contract also protects the customer. Every consumer protection group in America will advise a customer to get a signed contract. You really should attempt to educate your customers to never have work done by anyone without a signed contract. You don't intend to cheat the customer and she doesn't intend to cheat you and that's great but that doesn't mean the next fast talking, smooth operator that comes down the road won't try to take advantage of her.

Do this lady a favor and advise her to get signed contracts and lien waivers for all work that is done on her property to protect herself. If she calls her lawyer he will tell her the same thing. You don't get an 800 ft run of conduit to a gate opener unless you have some money so show her how to protect it.
Click to expand...

Thanks alot, but there will not be a contract........when I get into larger money jobs I have them sign and except a quote. I have one of those type of jobs begining next week, I'll be glad when its over, moving some 400amp disconects around for a chiller change
 
Mule said:
Then the customer also called today and stated that her plumber is going to do the trenching for free.
Click to expand...


haha, did you find it strange the she made a specific mention of this to you ? about how this plumber is going to trench 650' for free ? Let me ask you something, is your town really in the Twilight zone ? or are you just joking ?

I mean did you see Rod Serling out of the corner of your eye as you were talking to her ?

I don't know Mule, I guess if the Plumber is going to spend a couple of days trenching 650' @18" deep for free, you would be a rip off artist if you layed the conduit and pulled wire for anything more than $250. Just run #3's for voltage drop and factor in an extra $35 while your at it.
 
Rich R said:
haha, did you find it strange the she made a specific mention of this to you ? about how this plumber is going to trench 650' for free ? Let me ask you something, is your town really in the Twilight zone ? or are you just joking ?

I mean did you see Rod Serling out of the corner of your eye as you were talking to her ?

I don't know Mule, I guess if the Plumber is going to spend a couple of days trenching 650' @18" deep for free, you would be a rip off artist if you layed the conduit and pulled wire for anything more than $250. Just run #3's for voltage drop and factor in an extra $35 while your at it.
Click to expand...

My "Goodness" :-? This lady is a huge client that has a LOT of properties. It's not my place to judge the plumbers intentions, but I will tell you that she has used him for a long time and she is a super lady, and for a person whom has just lost her husband and living in the country, she might not feel real secure and why can't a person whom wants to help her do so? He'll probably send a helper out there, or perhaps do it himself...besides she's also is in the middle of building a pretty good size pool house at the time her husband passed away.

Thanks for the info.........And yes the plumber offering his services for free, make me feel like a heel, but I wont be able to offord that kind of a gift, but I definetly wont be a goug'er

Mule
 
Mule said:
My "Goodness" :-? This lady is a huge client that has a LOT of properties. It's not my place to judge the plumbers intentions, but I will tell you that she has used him for a long time and she is a super lady, and for a person whom has just lost her husband and living in the country, she might not feel real secure and why can't a person whom wants to help her do so? He'll probably send a helper out there, or perhaps do it himself...besides she's also is in the middle of building a pretty good size pool house at the time her husband passed away.

Thanks for the info.........And yes the plumber offering his services for free, make me feel like a heel, but I wont be able to offord that kind of a gift, but I definetly wont be a goug'er

Mule
Click to expand...
The key word here is "used". "She has used this plumber for a long time." :)
A 650ft. trench is a pretty big freebee.

"This lady is a huge client and has lots of properties."
This lady doesn't sound like she needs any charity work.
I could see helping someone out that really can't afford it and really needs some help but this just doesn't sound like the case.

I wish I could find contractors willing to do work for me for free then maybe I could afford to build a pretty good sized pool house too. :)

I know I don't know the situation, but just going by what you've posted this woman sounds quite wealthy and I wouldn't feel bad at all about charging for my services even if she is a super lady. :)
 
I can't image why a customer would mention that the plumber is working for free. What possible motive could there be??? Isn't that a little like handing someone an invoice & mentioning the last great customer that tipped you by rounding it up to the nearest $100?
 
aline said:
The key word here is "used". "She has used this plumber for a long time." :)
A 650ft. trench is a pretty big freebee.

"This lady is a huge client and has lots of properties."
This lady doesn't sound like she needs any charity work.
I could see helping someone out that really can't afford it and really needs some help but this just doesn't sound like the case.

I wish I could find contractors willing to do work for me for free then maybe I could afford to build a pretty good sized pool house too. :)

I know I don't know the situation, but just going by what you've posted this woman sounds quite wealthy and I wouldn't feel bad at all about charging for my services even if she is a super lady. :)
Click to expand...

YEP I agree, but the plumber's business is not my business, that's between her and him. It's just another job to me, I value her as a client and as a friend, and I will try to be as effecient as I can, as that's all I can do.
 
aline said:
The key word here is "used". "She has used this plumber for a long time." :)
A 650ft. trench is a pretty big freebee.
Click to expand...

Maybe it's a big deal and maybe it's not. It really depends, if he already has the Ditch Witch setting on site for other trenching and the soil is soft it not really that big of a deal and a chance to make some points with a good customer. If she has plenty of other work and doesn't question the rates or times submitted for work at her other propeties this may well be a good deal for both her and the plumber.

If this is considered a home improvement and it's not tax deductable then the plumber does this one for free and ups his bill at a business property that is tax deductable ( it's done all the time ). What looks like a freebee isn't so free after all but is a good jesture.

This lady may be a better business person than most EC's. At times they can appreciate a contractor that's willing to play ball and make things ( taxes) convenient for them. Just a thought.:confused:
 
growler said:
If this is considered a home improvement and it's not tax deductable then the plumber does this one for free and ups his bill at a business property that is tax deductable ( it's done all the time ). What looks like a freebee isn't so free after all but is a good jesture.

This lady may be a better business person than most EC's. At times they can appreciate a contractor that's willing to play ball and make things ( taxes) convenient for them. Just a thought.:confused:
Click to expand...
A super lady wouldn't dream of cheating on her taxes would she? :)

I personally wouldn't feel comfortable having someone work on my home for free if I had plenty of money to pay for the service. I often give them a tip, thank them and suggest they take their spouse out to dinner. In my opinion a super lady would insist on paying for the work.

This doesn't sound like a little old lady on surviving on social security. :)
 
aline said:
A super lady wouldn't dream of cheating on her taxes would she? :)

I personally wouldn't feel comfortable having someone work on my home for free if I had plenty of money to pay for the service. I often give them a tip, thank them and suggest they take their spouse out to dinner. In my opinion a super lady would insist on paying for the work.

This doesn't sound like a little old lady on surviving on social security. :)
Click to expand...

First you guys were riding me, then it was the plumber, then its some secret tax plan, now its the lady...always looking for the negative...never have anything good to say....sorry that's the way I see it....HOLD IT !!!! WHILE I PUT ON MY BULLET PROOF VEST...Ok go ahead...Im ready
 
jmsbrush said:
MULE, I used 3 different estimating programs to see what my labor rates were for what you wanted. 1 came out at 44 hours, the next came out at 60.
and my very expensive program it came out at 57 hours. I hoped this helped.
Click to expand...

Got my RSmeans working today...now Ive got to learn how to use it.....SHoo:rolleyes:
 
Mule said:
HOLD IT !!!! WHILE I PUT ON MY BULLET PROOF VEST...Ok go ahead...Im ready
Click to expand...

No bullets needed. As I've pointed out before, the opinions offered in these business threads are free and offered on the free time of the members here. You certainly don't have to take the advice offered, though do realize that many times the advice offered was obtained from the "School of Hard Knocks." So it's not just tripe.

Furthermore, unless someone is pointing a gun at your head, I'm assuming you're here voluntarily, no?
 
peter d said:
No bullets needed. As I've pointed out before, the opinions offered in these business threads are free and offered on the free time of the members here. You certainly don't have to take the advice offered, though do realize that many times the advice offered was obtained from the "School of Hard Knocks." So it's not just tripe.

Furthermore, unless someone is pointing a gun at your head, I'm assuming you're here voluntarily, no?
Click to expand...

So if what you say is true, MY opinions should be taken in stride as well? NO? Just like the previous one......Just calling it the way I see it..just like the rest....:smile: YES I appreciate all constructive suggestions...
 
Sometimes I just like to mess with people. Keeps the forum from becoming boring. :)

It can be hard to tell sometimes if someone is serious or just having fun stirring things up a little. I try not to take things too seriously on these forums. It's all in good fun as long as no one gets hurt. :)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top