Mudrings and Boxes

[JFletcher]

Is there any problem (code violation(s)) with setting a 1900 box back from the face of the stud and using a deeper ring to bring it flush with the drywall? Two reasons I want to do this: 1) More fill and 2) I have a load of 2" rings that will probably never get used otherwise.

 

[rcarroll]

I don't see a problem with it. :thumbsup:

 

[iwire]

No issue other than be careful when setting.

 

[nickelec]

In nyc its a violation to have more then 1/4" of space between the finish surface and the edge of a mud ring

Sent from my SM-N920P using Tapatalk

 

[infinity]

Is there any problem (code violation(s)) with setting a 1900 box back from the face of the stud and using a deeper ring to bring it flush with the drywall? Two reasons I want to do this: 1) More fill and 2) I have a load of 2" rings that will probably never get used otherwise.

The only problem that I see is that the mud ring won't be up against the back side of the drywall which means that the box must be very secure otherwise the mud ring will pull through the hole.

 

[JFletcher]

thanks guys. nickelec, are you saying the main body of the mudring (where the slots/holes are for the screws to the box) cannot be more than 1/4" back from the drywall, that the face (where the device mounts) cannot be more than 1/4" back, or that there cant be more than 1/4" gap around the edge of the ring? If it's the lattertwo, that's in the NEC. and if the wall type is combustible material like wood, there is no gap allowed.

I was thinking there might be a listing issue with the mudring main body not against the wall surface, especially if it a fire rated wall.

 

[jumper]

thanks guys. nickelec, are you saying the main body of the mudring (where the slots/holes are for the screws to the box) cannot be more than 1/4" back from the drywall, that the face (where the device mounts) cannot be more than 1/4" back, or that there cant be more than 1/4" gap around the edge of the ring?

That should be 1/8".

312.4 Repairing Noncombustible Surfaces.
Noncombustible surfaces that are broken or incomplete shall be re-
paired so there will be no gaps or open spaces greater than
3mm(1⁄8 in.) at the edge of the cabinet or cutout box
employing a flush-type cover

 

[Besoeker]

Ignorant Brit again.........
Mud ring?

 

[Smart $]

thanks guys. nickelec, are you saying the main body of the mudring (where the slots/holes are for the screws to the box) cannot be more than 1/4" back from the drywall, that the face (where the device mounts) cannot be more than 1/4" back, or that there cant be more than 1/4" gap around the edge of the ring? If it's the lattertwo, that's in the NEC. and if the wall type is combustible material like wood, there is no gap allowed.

I was thinking there might be a listing issue with the mudring main body not against the wall surface, especially if it a fire rated wall.

That should be 1/8".

312.4 Repairing Noncombustible Surfaces.
Noncombustible surfaces that are broken or incomplete shall be re-
paired so there will be no gaps or open spaces greater than
3mm(1⁄8 in.) at the edge of the cabinet or cutout box
employing a flush-type cover

As noted, gap is 1/8" for non-combustible surfaces.

Setback is 1/4" maximum in noncombustible surfaces, 0" in combustible.

314.20 In Wall or Ceiling. In walls or ceilings with a
surface of concrete, tile, gypsum, plaster, or other noncombustible
material, boxes employing a flush-type cover or
faceplate shall be installed so that the front edge of the box,
plaster ring, extension ring, or listed extender will not be
set back of the finished surface more than 6 mm (1⁄4 in.).
In walls and ceilings constructed of wood or other combustible
surface material, boxes, plaster rings, extension
rings, or listed extenders shall be flush with the finished
surface or project therefrom.

 

[GoldDigger]

Ignorant Brit again.........
Mud ring?

A sheet metal ring mounted between the front of the box and the finish surface.

Originally to allow setting plaster (mud) to make the finished wall while the box was behind the lath that supported the plaster.

Different depth rings available for different construction details.
Not quite the same as an extension ring but used interchangeably by many people.

 

[Besoeker]

A sheet metal ring mounted between the front of the box and the finish surface.

Originally to allow setting plaster (mud) to make the finished wall while the box was behind the lath that supported the plaster.

Different depth rings available for different construction details.
Not quite the same as an extension ring but used interchangeably by many people.

Clear as mud.............

 

[Ponchik]

Ignorant Brit again.........
Mud ring?

View attachment 15889
single gang 1/2" (12.7 mm) raised


View attachment 15890
single gang to 4" square extension ring

 

[Besoeker]

View attachment 15889
single gang 1/2" (12.7 mm) raised

Thanks.
But I just don't comprehend. And it's too late to walk my dog......................

 

[Ponchik]

View attachment 15891

View attachment 15892

2nd picture has the mud ring installed with a finished wall

 

[Besoeker]

View attachment 15891

View attachment 15892

2nd picture has the mud ring installed with a finished wall

Perhaps I will walk my dog.

 

[infinity]

Another application:

 

[Besoeker]

Another application:

Thanks. But still none the wiser. Sorry.

 

[wwhitney]

Thanks. But still none the wiser. Sorry.

The point is to allow the box to be bigger than the hole in the finish material. So if you have a metal box that's 4" x 4" (x some depth), and you only want a (roughly) 2" x 4" hole in your finish material, you use a "mudring". It's just a piece of metal that fits over the 4" x 4" opening, has a reduced size 2" x 4" opening, and has a projecting collar deep enough to extend through the finish material to the finished surface.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[electrofelon]

Thanks. But still none the wiser. Sorry.

To be blunt, what are you having trouble with? Do you not understand how it works or do you find it to be another silly American thing? If the latter, what do y'all use over there? Here, the 4 square box with mudring is the method used in 98% of commercial wiring.

 

[Besoeker]

The point is to allow the box to be bigger than the hole in the finish material. So if you have a metal box that's 4" x 4" (x some depth), and you only want a (roughly) 2" x 4" hole in your finish material, you use a "mudring". It's just a piece of metal that fits over the 4" x 4" opening, has a reduced size 2" x 4" opening, and has a projecting collar deep enough to extend through the finish material to the finished surface.

Cheers, Wayne

Thanks Wayne. I see now.