Need help figuring out why I came in so high on a price?

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erusek

Member
Hey everyone just submitted a quote for a 2 family in Northern New Jersey. It was an old house that's being renovated down to studs everything new. It could be a 3 family but owner wants 2nd and 3rd floor. I submitted a price of $22,500. The owner got another price by a licensed electrician doing houses for the guys uncle at total of $8000 and I'm spinning because I'm trying to figure out if I'm way to high or is this other guy gonna get killed so here goes.

Garage 600 sq ft wants 60 amp subpanel out there trench will be dug but comes off 2nd floor panel. Garage will be for storage 8 outlets total, 3 lights 2 switches, (1) smoke and co2 detectors.

Basement 917 sq ft circuits coming off the 2nd floor panel. 4 quads, (2) 3 ways, (1) single pole, (3) lights (1) smoke and co2 detector.

1st Floor 917 sq ft it's own apartment (2) bedrooms, kitchen, bathroom, laundry rm, living rm and hallway. (38) outlets, (6) 3 way switches (3) 4 way switches, (7) single pole switches, (10) lights (4) smokes and (1) co2.

2nd floor 1040 sq ft owners apartment consists of 1 bathroom, big kitchen, family room, breakfast room, dining room, laundry room. (36) outlets, (12) 3 ways, (8) single pole switches, (14) lights, (1) smoke (1) co2 detector.

3rd floor 1108 sq ft consists of (2) bedrooms, (1) master bedroom, (1) master bathroom, (1) smaller bathroom. (30) outlets, (6) 3 ways, (7) single poles, (10) lights (4) smokes and (1) co2.

2 outside Ac units 1st floor 2 ton
2nd floor 4 ton

Service owner wants panels on 1st floor and 2nd floor but locations for the panels are on the opposite side of where the service comes in. So I figured (2) metermain combos with SER cable to each subpanel. 200 Amp service. Owner doesn't have any appliances yet so I figured 100 amp sub 1st floor and 150 sub 2nd floor.

That's the job plus demo and temp power. The owner told me the other electrician said $8000 for everything except basement which is the cheapest part and he thought that was too high. He said this same guy is wiring a couple houses now for his uncle and works alone. Any help on average price for this job would be great because I'm confused and wondering what to do.

Thanks
 
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erusek

Member
You're probably right I laughed and said good luck. Just wondering if my price of 22,500 is in the ballpark (the normal people's ballpark)?
 
NolaTigaBait

NolaTigaBait

Senior Member
Location
New Orleans,LA
I'm not taking the time to figure what I would charge, but 8k is ridiculous. Think about how many kitchens you have and how many floors, service equipment, arc faults...The list goes on and on....I'd move on to the next job, this guy is looking for a freebe.
 
T

ty

Senior Member
Location
3rd Rock from the Sun
I just did a quick take off and came up with $18,480. alot closer to your # than $8,000.
I could have missed something, as I didn't actually walk the job and our pricing is usually a bit lower than North Jersey.
So your price doesn't seem to be far out of line.
 
jjhoward

jjhoward

Senior Member
Location
Northern NJ
Occupation
Owner TJ Electric
I did a quick run with your information: $18,500 without any service work.
So, I'd say your figure is right on.
Don't let this guy's ridiculous low figure fool you.
Either he is full of it or the other guy is full of it.

Stay away. You don't need ?work? like that.
I am in NJ also, would you PM me with more info about the GC?
Thank you.
 
J

jmellc

Senior Member
Location
Durham, NC
Occupation
Facility Maintenance Tech. Licensed Electrician
Chamuit said:
Ditto.

Lost a job to another guy Friday. His price was the cost of my material. Dunno how they do it. Told the Lady it was a smoking deal!
Click to expand...
Don't know your situation there, but around here every leaf raker and painter also does electrical work. They buy cheapest mtl they can find, make open splices in walls and crawl spaces, tap 240v ckts for a 120v recpt or light, let the cables hang to the ground, etc. They can do it for a dime against your dollar. Hey, it works. Light comes on when you flip a switch, well usually does. Saves lots of $. Wire doesn't usually heat up too much. GFCI and AFCI don't exist.
 
Mike Lang

Mike Lang

Senior Member
Location
New Jersey
jjhoward said:
I did a quick run with your information: $18,500 without any service work.
So, I'd say your figure is right on.
Don't let this guy's ridiculous low figure fool you.
Either he is full of it or the other guy is full of it.

Stay away. You don't need ?work? like that.
I am in NJ also, would you PM me with more info about the GC?
Thank you.
Click to expand...

I've run into several builders like this in the past year (also in NJ)... and you're exactly right you don't need his work. If that guy wants to wire it for 8K let him do it, you'll be happy you did. It sucks because you second guess yourself and your estimating but stick to your numbers.
 
DavidA

DavidA

Member
Location
Fresno, CA
The only problem is letting know in a polite way that you might be avaliable to 'fix' the wiring after the first contractor disappears.
 
petersonra

petersonra

Senior Member
Location
Northern illinois
Occupation
engineer
It might be that the other guy is not planning on a complete gut job.

He might also be reusing existing parts, or even planning on using used/refurbished parts.

You can get down right creative with costs if you are good at it.

We occasionally lose projects on price. If it is a straight up comparison we do well, but if we are bidding new parts and the other guy is bidding eBay parts, we will not look all that good cost wise. It can be very hard to fight that kind of thing because used parts are a heck of a bargain, and there is nothing wrong with them, as long as the owner knows just what he is getting. In fact, we have done a fair number of jobs that used "preowned" parts.

The other thing that you might take into account is the statement that "the other guy works alone". I have some relatives on my wife's side that are in construction and this could well describe them. They have little in the way of overhead. Their equipment consists of probably less then $1000 worth of hand tools. No fancy trucks. No employees. No advertising. The office is a desk in the basement (in one guy's case it is his easy chair). They work for the same group of people renovating houses and other buildings, and they stay pretty busy, even during the last few years. They make a decent enough living at it. They have some serious limitations on what they can do, but if it is something they can handle, they can do it for a whole lot less than the average contractor could who has a lot of expenses they don't.
 
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petersonra

petersonra

Senior Member
Location
Northern illinois
Occupation
engineer
I wanted to add something but took too long.

Along the apples to apples comparison line, it might be that the other guy is bidding labor only, parts only, or is taking the job on what amounts to a T&M basis and the $8000 is an estimate, and not a fixed price. Its also possible the owner is lying about it, or seriously misrepresenting it.

There are so many unknowns about the $8000 number that it is hard to tell much from it. I would just move on and not worry about it all that much. Its clear you cannot compete with this guy on this job using your business model.
 
S

satcom

Senior Member
petersonra said:
I wanted to add something but took too long.

Along the apples to apples comparison line, it might be that the other guy is bidding labor only, parts only, or is taking the job on what amounts to a T&M basis and the $8000 is an estimate, and not a fixed price. Its also possible the owner is lying about it, or seriously misrepresenting it.

There are so many unknowns about the $8000 number that it is hard to tell much from it. I would just move on and not worry about it all that much. Its clear you cannot compete with this guy on this job using your business model.
Click to expand...

If he din't see it in writing, the owner is most likely trying to get him to lower his price, and has no such price.

Bob is right "just move on and not worry about it all that much. Its clear you cannot compete with this guy on this job using your business model"
 
R

rodneee

Senior Member
he bid the openings @ $25 each....qty of 215 (plus or minus by my count) equals $5,375 and figured $2625 for everything else for a total of $8000. i am sure he will make money as long as the truck he hijacked was fully loaded with electrical material.
 
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