New AFCI rule (for the resi guys)

Learn the NEC with Mike Holt now!

New AFCI rule (for the resi guys)

  • I'm going to install less circuits so I can install less AFCI's

    Votes: 13 20.6%

  • I'm not going to change anything about circuit layout stuff the panel full of AFCI's

    Votes: 42 66.7%

  • I'm going to defy the NEC and not install AFCI's at all

    Votes: 8 12.7%
  • Total voters
    63
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cschmid said:
I think doing it that way just enables the HO to remove outlet at first sign of problem..
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That "logic" applies to every single thing we do. The Ho can alter whatever they want whenever they want whether it make sense or not and I think you are giving them far more credit than what is warranted.
 
Just spoke with the Square D rep in my area and he said they are coming out with a 54 space panel to try to accommodate the extra spaces.
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They have sold 54 space panels for years. Most of them in Canada, but I have bought them for heat trace systems where we use breakers with a "bell alarm" option. That option closes a contact when the breaker trips, but it takes up a breaker space.
Don
 
It was me!

It was me!

I chose the "defy the NEC. Never ever install another AFCI as long as I shall live!"

Will I? Of course.
Am I'm trying to be difficult? You bet!

I don't believe in the AFCI reliability, and from the 1999 - 2002 change, Mike Holt was still trying to get it removed from the code.

Now, have AFCI's changed? I have heard they have. Are they better? I don't know.

If I can wire a commercial building that houses $400 million in computer equipment, and it does not require an AFCI, why do I need one in a home that costs $150,000?

I still can't answer it!

Regarding some of the comments about not putting them in... There are AHJs who have not adopted certain versions of the code. Here in Colorado, the state never approved the 1996 NEC. They used the 1993 for 6 years. Then adopted the 1999...
I guess other areas do the same.
 
Greg Swartz said:
If I can wire a commercial building that houses $400 million in computer equipment, and it does not require an AFCI, why do I need one in a home that costs $150,000?

I still can't answer it!
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I can. People don't sleep in commercial buildings. (Well, they're not supposed to, anyway. :cool:)
 
Greg Swartz said:
If I can wire a commercial building that houses $400 million in computer equipment, and it does not require an AFCI, why do I need one in a home that costs $150,000?
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I have heard that Chicago has a much lower incidence of electrical fires as they only allow rigid wiring methods such as EMT with a very limited amount of flexible conduit for connections.
 
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Greg Swartz said:
If I can wire a commercial building that houses $400 million in computer equipment, and it does not require an AFCI, why do I need one in a home that costs $150,000?

I still can't answer it!
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I agree with Larry, it has to do with the fact people live there.

Also most places that have 400 million in computer equipment usually have fire suppression systems and a more sophisticated fire alarm system then a couple of smoke alarms.
 
tom baker said:
. . . Chicago has a much lower incidence of electrical fires as they only allow rigid wiring methods such as EMT with a very limited amount of flexible conduit for connections.
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This is something that I often find missing from wiring-method discussions.

Conduit is as much for protecting the environment from the wiring as it is for protecting the wiring from the environment.

Remember that the F in NFPA stands for fire, and not an expletive that often follows a shock.
 
tom baker said:
I have heard that Chicago has a much lower incidence of electrical fires as
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Yeah I have heard that......from people who live and work from that area. :smile:

It could be true, it could be the conduit that makes it so.

Or it could be something as simple as fire department(s) that does a better job investigating the cause of a fire then many departments that quickly jump to 'It's electrical'

We really do not know. :)
 
If upgrading the service, or just replacing an old panel with a new one, would the new one need to contain AFCI breakers, or are AFCI's only needed for newly-built homes?
 
jeff48356 said:
If upgrading the service, or just replacing an old panel with a new one, would the new one need to contain AFCI breakers, or are AFCI's only needed for newly-built homes?
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I think most jurisdictions decide this individually. It's really a local thing. Check with the inspectors in your area.

Of course, if they are not required, you can always "upsell" the customer on them.
 
Can someone point me in the right direction so that I can view the new requirements for the AFCI's im just a little behind on this? Thanks guys
 
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