odd arrangement of 2-pole breaker ties

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480sparky said:
Just remember: There are 10 types of people in the world..... those who understand binary, and those who don't.
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Would these be "decimal" people?

Heinz R.
 
Thanks for the education, folks. As always, you came through helping me understand the real electrical world.
Heinz R.
 
While these breakers are very common in manufactured homes, the reason they are not that pricey is because they are not common trip breakers, they only have handle ties for disconnecting purpose, a common trip breaker would be imposable for the outer two breakers. I had to replace one and was surprised the cost wasn't as bad as I was expecting.
Of course as was said, the trailer manufactures buy them at truck load prices so for them there even lower, but they are used as space in a manufactured home is a premium so as was posted is correct.

If you ever need any, look for a trailer parts supply house, they keep them stocked in all sizes, great when you need to add an AC unit to the inside panel if the outside disconnect don't have a space for it. you can get them it about any configuration, I have used ones with a 15 amp on one side and a 20 amp on the other with a double 30 amp in the middle.

I have seen trailers with all tandems and or quads even with half of the panel empty.
 
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I don't buy the space is a premium situation in a moblie or manufactured home.

What is above or below the panel in almost every one of these homes? Nothing but room for a larger panel. What is allowed above or below the panel according to 110.26? Pretty much nothing unless electrical in nature. I think they want smaller panels for weight reasons. The tandems and quads will fit more poles in a smaller overall lighter assembly.
 
hurk27 said:
While these breakers are very common in manufactured homes, the reason they are not that pricey is because they are not common trip breakers, they only have handle ties for disconnecting purpose, a common trip breaker would be imposable for the outer two breakers. I had to replace one and was surprised the cost wasn't as bad as I was expecting.
Of course as was said, the trailer manufactures buy them at truck load prices so for them there even lower, but they are used as space in a manufactured home is a premium so as was posted is correct.

If you ever need any, look for a trailer parts supply house, they keep them stocked in all sizes, great when you need to add an AC unit to the inside panel if the outside disconnect don't have a space for it. you can get them it about any configuration, I have used ones with a 15 amp on one side and a 20 amp on the other with a double 30 amp in the middle.

I have seen trailers with all tandems and or quads even with half of the panel empty.
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Wayne quad breakers with both the inner and outer poles having common trip are readily available.

Look at the right column on page 79 here:
http://www.eaton.com/ecm/idcplg?IdcService=GET_FILE&dID=353658


Look at the bottom of the page here:
http://cmsapps.sea.siemens.com/controls/speedfax07/07Speedfax_pdfs/07Speedfax_01/01_25.pdf
 
1/2 size, twin and quad circuit breakers are very common here on the west coast. Most of the combination service entrance devices are only available with 12/24 or 20/40 loadcenters.
 
curt swartz said:
Wayne quad breakers with both the inner and outer poles having common trip are readily available.

Look at the right column on page 79 here:
http://www.eaton.com/ecm/idcplg?IdcService=GET_FILE&dID=353658


Look at the bottom of the page here:
http://cmsapps.sea.siemens.com/controls/speedfax07/07Speedfax_pdfs/07Speedfax_01/01_25.pdf
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I haven't really looked in a while, but I seem to remember seeing the NON-common trip on them like in post 2 of the 30/50/50/30 at the bottom, if you look on the right side under the metal handle ties for the outer two, I went to a trailer supply one time to get a replacement and was surprised by the seemingly lower the expected price, and was told it was because they were not common trip in trailers? could have been older trailers too?:confused:

Also like the one in post 13 link of the mistake quad.
 
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LarryFine said:
"Space" and "smaller" do suggest similar goals. :cool:
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But the reality is that if you installed a 12/24 space panelboard you still have the same space required by 110.26 as you do for an 84 space panelboard. Amount of living space of the home did not change in any way. I still think weight comes more into play than space.

These things do have to be pulled down the road and have weight restrictions. More weight may mean more axles are needed, alternate routes may need to be planned an so forth.

I wish I would have taken pictures, recently there was a truck passing through near where I live carrying a huge substation transformer that was going to a nearby wind power farm currently under construction.

That truck had several axles under it already but they spent pretty much a whole day adding more axles to the trailer so they could drive it a couple miles, cross a bridge, and then spend most of the next day removing all the extra axles.
 
hurk27 said:
While these breakers are very common in manufactured homes, the reason they are not that pricey is because they are not common trip breakers, they only have handle ties for disconnecting purpose, a common trip breaker would be imposable for the outer two breakers.
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Did you note the photo in the (second?) post where Westinghouse specifically notes them as Common Trip? While I agree with you that it seems unlikely, it appears they got them listed that way.

My childhood home had them when air conditioning was added to a panel; I don't RECALL any problems, but I left it in the late 60's.
 
GeorgeB said:
Did you note the photo in the (second?) post where Westinghouse specifically notes them as Common Trip? While I agree with you that it seems unlikely, it appears they got them listed that way.

My childhood home had them when air conditioning was added to a panel; I don't RECALL any problems, but I left it in the late 60's.
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There won't be any problem other than that if one pole trips the other one does not necessarily open with it. If it is indeed a common trip then they both open even though only one pole has the trip condition. The same happens if fuses instead of common trip breakers are used. Ground fault on one pole only opens one pole.
 
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