Panel in Bathroom

[stickboy1375]

Dennis, I don't care if a light switch corrodes a little or if a bit of moisture gets into a light. However, I do care if an overcurrent device doesn't operate. Considering the open nature of a molded case circuit breaker, I don't want any moisture in there.

As far as the outside overcurrent devices in NEMA 3R enclosures, they are listed for the purpose. With that said and from a personal standpoint, I don't like outside installations of overcurrent devices. There are situations that require installations in NEMA 3R enclosures and the panel is OK with that. I can't speak for the rest of the panel but that is the way I feel about the situation.

Last I checked, I use the same breakers in a 3R panel as the ones in a non 3R panel, so not sure I understand your post.


I guess I just dont know why a bathroom has moisture but outside does not?

 

[charlie]

Last I checked, I use the same breakers in a 3R panel as the ones in a non 3R panel, so not sure I understand your post.

You are correct, the circuit breakers are the same. I am stating a personal opinion that I do not like NEMA 3R installations. However, since the third party listing says it is OK, the CMP is OK with those installations.

 

[stickboy1375]

You are correct, the circuit breakers are the same. I am stating a personal opinion that I do not like NEMA 3R installations. However, since the third party listing says it is OK, the CMP is OK with those installations.

Okay... just checking... :grin:

 

[C3PO]

I guess I just dont know why a bathroom has moisture but outside does not?

IMHO I think a panel in a small bathroom with a shower in it is going to be exposed to a lot more concentrated moisture hanging in the air than a panel outside.

 

[wbalsam1]

.......... The panel had quite a discussion about small shower areas in spas and fitness centers. ...........

I didn't realize "panels" could talk....must be a group of "panels" would make up a "panelboard"......(groan:grin: :grin: )!

 

[mivey]

I didn't realize "panels" could talk....must be a group of "panels" would make up a "panelboard"......(groan:grin: :grin: )!

Let's give a big hand to the Jay man. He'll be here all week folks.:grin:

 

[stickboy1375]

IMHO I think a panel in a small bathroom with a shower in it is going to be exposed to a lot more concentrated moisture hanging in the air than a panel outside.

Possible, but for how long vs outside? I mean, damp is damp correct?

 

[charlie]

I didn't realize "panels" could talk....must be a group of "panels" would make up a "panelboard"......(groan :grin: :grin: )!

I was going to say something but then I would have to ban myself for using inappropriate language.

 

[Brad Baxter]

Question?

Question?

Panels were permitted in bathrooms of dwelling units until the change in the '93 code cycle. We see many locations in existing homes where the panel is in the bathroom.

So my question to you is if a service upgrade is to be performed then

could you just junction the panel homeruns lv it as a big jbox and leave in the current location in the bathroom and place a new panel with breakers elsewhere?

 

[wbalsam1]

So my question to you is if a service upgrade is to be performed then

could you just junction the panel homeruns lv it as a big jbox and leave in the current location in the bathroom and place a new panel with breakers elsewhere?

I realize your question is to Pierre, but to chime in here, I see no reason why you couldn't do this. As long as you don't have any overcurrent protective devices in the bathroom, the problem goes away.

Bring the required amount of branch circuits from the new panel location to this old panel location (with the panelboard part of the panel removed and the cover arranged to effectively cover the junctions) and in all other aspects comply with the code and you're all set. I've see this done many times....also with clothes closets, too. :smile:

 

[Pierre C Belarge]

I realize your question is to Pierre, but to chime in here, I see no reason why you couldn't do this. As long as you don't have any overcurrent protective devices in the bathroom, the problem goes away.

Bring the required amount of branch circuits from the new panel location to this old panel location (with the panelboard part of the panel removed and the cover arranged to effectively cover the junctions) and in all other aspects comply with the code and you're all set. I've see this done many times....also with clothes closets, too. :smile:

Brad
Us NYers stick together...

 

[C3PO]

I realize your question is to Pierre, but to chime in here, I see no reason why you couldn't do this. As long as you don't have any overcurrent protective devices in the bathroom, the problem goes away.

Bring the required amount of branch circuits from the new panel location to this old panel location (with the panelboard part of the panel removed and the cover arranged to effectively cover the junctions) and in all other aspects comply with the code and you're all set. I've see this done many times....also with clothes closets, too. :smile:

Why would you have to do this for a change out. The NEC is not retroactive.
IMHO you should be able to just change the panel. Not that I would want my panel in a bathroom, I just do not think you should have to move it if you are doing a service change.

 

[wbalsam1]

Why would you have to do this for a change out. The NEC is not retroactive.
IMHO you should be able to just change the panel. Not that I would want my panel in a bathroom, I just do not think you should have to move it if you are doing a service change.

I agree with you. If it's an emergency repair or an everyday type replacement with like or similar equipment, then it is not really an extension of an existing electrical system or an installation of a new electrical system and as such would not require an electrical permit in most jurisdictions I'm familiar with. I must have misunderstood the question. :smile:

 

[Brad Baxter]

Panel relocation.

Panel relocation.

This is a ? in many eyes. I would think that if you performed a service upgrade and placed the new panel in the bathroom that it would be dated as a new installation in 2008 and would violate the code by placing the new overcurrent devices in the bathroom. Although it could be listed as an existing changeover and might pass. ???????? seems like a interesting case.

 

[wbalsam1]

This is a ? in many eyes. I would think that if you performed a service upgrade and placed the new panel in the bathroom that it would be dated as a new installation in 2008 and would violate the code by placing the new overcurrent devices in the bathroom. Although it could be listed as an existing changeover and might pass. ???????? seems like a interesting case.

An "upgrade" to me suggests or implies an increase in amperage. This would be an electrical alteration and require a permit/inspection. A permit can only be issued when all provisions of the code are satisfied. I would deny the permit based on this. But if it were not an upgrade but simply a panel change out with a similar panel, or a service cable or riser replacement, I would OK it. :smile:

 

[C3PO]

An "upgrade" to me suggests or implies an increase in amperage. This would be an electrical alteration and require a permit/inspection. A permit can only be issued when all provisions of the code are satisfied. I would deny the permit based on this. But if it were not an upgrade but simply a panel change out with a similar panel, or a service cable or riser replacement, I would OK it. :smile:

I agree. If it is just a change out it would be ok. (At least around here)
If you are going from a 100A to a 200A service or something like that, it might get interesting.