PM Position

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mstrlucky74

Senior Member
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NJ
I believe I asked this before but now it's real. Been estimating for a while now and have a real chance to work out in field as a PM. Really trying to weight the pros/cons of each. Tough call. Thanks

Not sure what happened to poll.

Anyway.

1. Continue estimating for a few more years.
2. Take the PM position.
 
I believe I asked this before but now it's real. Been estimating for a while now and have a real chance to work out in field as a PM. Really trying to weight the pros/cons of each. Tough call. Thanks

Not sure what happened to poll.

Anyway.

1. Continue estimating for a few more years.
2. Take the PM position.

Is this PM job on a big jobsite?
Most full time PM's are in the office, but can go live on large jobsites when needed.
I've done both and learned a ton, but I found estimating to be my favorite. Probably because I was better at it.
I worked for one company where we had a sales quota and we had to manage the jobs we estimated. And these were large jobs. Talk about stressful.
Estimators walk the line of making sure everything is covered, but staying competitive and make the sale.
PM's are handed your "low bidder" estimate, find your mistakes and omissions, and try to squeeze a profit out of it.

I would say do it. It gives you a whole different perspective on the business. It's a complete different kind of stress.
 
I believe I asked this before but now it's real. Been estimating for a while now and have a real chance to work out in field as a PM. Really trying to weight the pros/cons of each. Tough call. Thanks

Not sure what happened to poll.

Anyway.

1. Continue estimating for a few more years.
2. Take the PM position.

PM means a lot of things to different people.

What is the job description for the particular PM position you're looking for? If it matches your skill level with growth potential, go for it.

Usually, a PM starts at the Assistant PM level and works up the chain that way.
 
... Really trying to weight the pros/cons of each. ...

1. Continue estimating for a few more years.
2. Take the PM position.

Edit: Erasing what I wrote and really wanted to say. I might get banned.

I'm a dirt dog - work in the field. With a few exceptions, I don't like being around project management. Which really, really doesn't matter at all.

There are only two questions;
  1. Does it sound like something you want to do?
  2. In the long term, is it more money?

Yes, Yes - get at it now or yesterday
Yes, No - Consider another vocation. One you like and pays more. Training, school, move across the country - what ever it takes.
No, Yes - You really want to consider another vocation.
No, No - And your question was?

And I am one of those with no data - just another person with an opinion.
 
Feel free I'm a big boy; I think you would be putting your career in jeopardy. Very big step from estimating to PM. You did ask and will do as you think best I would hope, not what some unknown person tells you over the interwebs; plus I charge much more to be a life coach/mentor! ;)
 
Feel free I'm a big boy; I think you would be putting your career in jeopardy. Very big step from estimating to PM. You did ask and will do as you think best I would hope, not what some unknown person tells you over the interwebs; plus I charge much more to be a life coach/mentor! ;)

LOL...I do appreciate the advice.
 
I'm a dirt dog - work in the field. With a few exceptions, I don't like being around project management. Which really, really doesn't matter at all.

There are only two questions;
  1. Does it sound like something you want to do?
  2. In the long term, is it more money?

Yes, Yes - get at it now or yesterday
Yes, No - Consider another vocation. One you like and pays more. Training, school, move across the country - what ever it takes.
No, Yes - You really want to consider another vocation.
No, No - And your question was?

And I am one of those with no data - just another person with an opinion.


Thanks.
 
Very big step from estimating to PM.

Not really.....it's a lateral move. Once you have done both, you can go back and forth through your career based on demand.
Estimators and PM's in my office all made anywhere from $80k-$100k (all with senior experience/all Masters)

I don't like being around project management

You're probably not suited for this position....just one man's opinion

PM means a lot of things to different people.

Only if you don't understand what they do. Every written job description of Electrical PM I've ever seen is almost identical
 
Typical Electrical PM job description:

Project Manager - Electrical:
The Project Manager/ Electrical has full responsibility for assigned electrical projects. Will be responsible
for estimating, cost control, forecasting and scheduling multiple projects through final project completion.
The PM will be the Owner’s point of contact and will coordinate the job team to meet all project goals.

Responsibilities:
• PM responsibilities include: submittals, purchase orders, materials contracts and subcontracts,
change orders, as-built documents, and to ensure the high quality of all work performed at a job
site.
• Plan, schedule, and maintain timelines by optimizing resources in a fast paced
construction/installation environment.
• Manage cost, schedule and resource-loaded schedules providing billings, cash flow and
manpower forecasting with complete job costing reviews.
• Monitoring for compliance with all applicable laws. Assist in the preparation of technical
proposals, including assisting in the design and writing the scope of work, management plans,
work sequence, safety, and quality control and commissioning.
• Manage all job closeout procedures.
• Develop/maintain network of professional relationships within the industry.

Qualifications:
• Bachelor’s Degree - Electrical Engineering or Construction Management, with 10 years of
experience working in electrical construction, or: Licensed Electrician (MA, RI, CT) with 20 years’
experience in electrical construction supervision.
• History of strong client relations and people management skills.
• Proficiency using various software applications (CADD, P-6 Scheduling, MS Office Suite, and
Estimating Software).
• Experience reading and interpreting construction plans and specifications and applicable code
requirements.
• Experience with contract documents: contract drawings, specifications, subcontracts, contract
addendum, and change orders
 
CD, to me I see a big difference; looking at your definition the PM is really running the business. An estimator key punches information into a canned program provided by the Co. and may or not have the flexibility to deviate from the Excel.
Our Mrlucky appears to be bidding large projects, review his questions, I don't know how much slack he is given or his full background; unless he has run big jobs before I feel he would be in trouble. You have to know when to wash the other hand or lock horns and say no way. Not saying he couldn't do it, but I have seen people lose their job by trying to help out, fail then be blamed.
 
looking at your definition the PM is really running the business

Nope....every bullet point of the description I posted is required on EVERY job you manage. It might be 6 jobs you are managing or just one. To be clear, these are commercial jobs ranging from $500k to $10 million electrical jobs, which is what Mrlucky works on, as did I. These jobs run from 6 months to 2 years in duration.

An estimator key punches information into a canned program provided by the Co. and may or not have the flexibility to deviate from the Excel.

Sorry....this is almost offensive. This isn't counting plugs and fixture opening and "punching" them into a spreadsheet. These jobs can take weeks to estimate. Some take a team of estimators a month to estimate.
These programs are very sophisticated and cost $20-$30k .

I've been as hard on him as anyone, challenging him to think about what he is asking, telling him to go back and look at the specs, plans, and documents. Most of his questions he knows the answer.

I think this will be a good move for him to understand how estimating and PM tie together.
It's like when I started out....I only got to work on the house rough-in crew....for months and months When I finally got to trim out, everything made sense why they insisted on things being done a certain way
 
I started in the trade many moons ago.

Seventeen and 1/2 years of age, 6'-0" and 140 lb, and my first job as an apprentice; they put me on a 90 lb. Jackhammer at Miami International Airport.

I was one of those guys that were headed for the top in spite of anything anyone told me. Hey, dreams are important!

Every time, if I asked, what they thought I should try this or take that position, they always said no. Thank God I didn't listen to any of them.

If you think you can handle the position, apply for it. Most people will give you good advice, but it's usually a reflection of what they will do which may not be in your best interest. It's up to the guy that's hiring you to figure out if you overshoot your ability based on the position he/she is looking for.
 
Nope....every bullet point of the description I posted is required on EVERY job you manage. It might be 6 jobs you are managing or just one. To be clear, these are commercial jobs ranging from $500k to $10 million electrical jobs, which is what Mrlucky works on, as did I. These jobs run from 6 months to 2 years in duration.

Some the questions Mr Lucky asks (not trying to offend here), he wouldn't make a great PM on the small projects like I work on - those the PM is also the lead Jman for the most part, but for jobs like you describe $10 million - 2 years, etc. the PM may not even need to know how to hold a screwdriver, he has way to many other things to handle in the office and lets the crew leaders worry about how to use the tools and install specific items. More you know about how things work the more it may help you relate to those crew members though.
 
Typical Electrical PM job description:


Yes, the contractor will post this and then say he will pay you 35,000 to 50,000 a year! lol

It all looks good on paper but in the end, just showing up and giving it your best is 90 percent of the title...

I applied for a PM job onetime and they asked me what I wanted. I said $150,000.00. They said that's too much. I said, well you asked me what I thought it was worth. Now, what are you willing to pay.
 
Some the questions Mr Lucky asks (not trying to offend here), he wouldn't make a great PM on the small projects like I work on - those the PM is also the lead Jman for the most part, but for jobs like you describe $10 million - 2 years, etc. the PM may not even need to know how to hold a screwdriver, he has way to many other things to handle in the office and lets the crew leaders worry about how to use the tools and install specific items. More you know about how things work the more it may help you relate to those crew members though.

TY
 
None of us know enough detail to advise but, and excuse me for being blunt, to quote Dirty Harry, "a man has to know his limitations". To me, you seem very dedicated and show desire to make sure jobs are completed in the best possible manner, but based on your questions often showing a lack of knowledge of some basics of field practices, I would shoot for an assistant PM for the 1st step.
 
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