Pool Cover Key Switch 2-way switch to 3-way switch

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drblkjk

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We recently installed a pool cover with a 2-way key switch next to the pool equipment that runs the cover motor - open and closed. We installed empty conduit from the existing switch into the house - so we can install another open/close switch inside the house - aesthetic purposes.

Existing Switch.JPGProposed Layout.JPG

The switch is apparently proprietary and only only supplied to pool cover installers. The company that installed the existing switch said they will not install another switch - only one switch will work to the motor. My electrical contractor said it should be straight forward, but I should check with a higher authority...he is not familiar with these switches and he really told me to figure it out and he will install it.

Are these switches proprietary or can I order them off the Internet?
Is it true that wiring these switches as 3-way will not work or it is a bad idea?
Can these switches be wired to work as a 3-way?

Notes - there is a requirement to be able to see inside the pool when operating the switch(es)...requirement is met. Also switch height is 48" above ground...requirement met. The proposed switch inside the house does not need to be a key switch.

Thanks in advance.
 
Even if the switch is proprietary (which I doubt very much), the function of any manual switch is not all that hard to duplicate.

That does not appear to be a 3-way switch... or rather it does not perform the function of a 3-way. It's likely wired forward-off-reverse.

It's possible to devise two-location control, but you'll want to defeat the other switch so only one switch can control the motor at any instant, with one having priority (poolside, I assume).

You'd probably end up moving the one pictured to inside the house and getting a new one for the current location. It'll just be a forward-off-reverse switch with auxiliary contacts to defeat the other switch.
 
BTW, defeating the second switch while the first is in use may not be necessary. Depends on whether the motor starter has an interlocked reversing contactor. If it does, the first operated switch has priority and the second is ignored if turned to the opposite direction.

If the motor direction is simply a function of the switched input (i.e. no motor starter other than the switch itself), then you'd want the defeat function.
 
No, that is not a proprietary switch. I thought it looked like an IDEC and confirmed that by zooming in on the picture where you can see IDEC printed on the side. http://us.idec.com/Home.aspx

It is actually 2 switches below the switch body. I would suspect one is NO (normally open) and the other NC (normally closed). With a jumper between the two, and you have a bi-directional switch. (Oh, depending on how the key operates, they are probably both NO switches....I need more coffee this morning)

I suspect that the switch body (key) is a 3-position switch with Off, Forward, Reverse momentary positions. You wouldn't want this to be a 3-way switch (not to be confused with 3-position), but you may need to ensure that 2 different switches are not simultaneously operated in opposing directions.
 
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Your electrical contractor appears to be correct...pretty straightforward...appears to be an off-the-shelf selector switch.
The added switch should be an easy install either with or without priority selection as noted by the other posts.
 
I am assuming the pool cover motor is hydraulic... YES????? If so the switch just reverses the valve so that the hydraulics go one way or the other. These switches must be momentary contact switch if I remember correctly with a center off position. There should not be any reason that this cannot be done.

Perhaps the company is covering themselves because two people can use the switches at the same time and possibly giving opposite commands. Not sure that would hurt anything tho.
 
More information!

More information!

Thank you everyone!

I have attached a few more pictures including the front face. Yes, it is manual forward, off and reverse.

Thanks for the link Rick. I was able to find the switch on line?not proprietary!

Yes Smart $, the poolside switch should have priority.

Smart $...??with auxiliary contacts to defeat the other switch.??is it possible to ?defeat the other switch? via wiring, or do I need to buy 2 new switches that both can work together?

Here is link to the motor manual and trouble shooting guide http://www.poolcovers.com/more-info/documents-manuals-instructions-etc/ . It is an electric motor, not hydraulic.

Yes Rick, you can see the jumper wire. Looks like both are NO. Yes, I need a way to make sure there is not a conflicting signal.

Dennis?it is very unlikely that both switches would operate at the same time, but yet it could happen and that is likely why the install company is not supportive.

Key Switch.JPGConnections.JPGPool Cover Motor1.JPGPool Cover Motor2.jpgPool Cover Motor3.JPG
 
I can see why they do not want to do it. I think you could do it so it works safely. But it is clear they do not intend for this mode of operation.
 
Since they are key switches, one way to minimize the chance of a conflict will be to use the key like a Kirk-key.
"Archive" all but one of the keys and use that one for both switches.
Q1: Is the switch momentary with return to center?
Q2: Do you hold the switch in open or close position and let limit switches stop the motor or do you just start the cover moving and then release?


Tapatalk!
 
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drblkjk said:
... I was able to find the switch on line?

Smart $...??with auxiliary contacts to defeat the other switch.??is it possible to ?defeat the other switch? via wiring, or do I need to buy 2 new switches that both can work together?
Click to expand...
Switch series, modules, etc....???

Can't defeat with wiring... has to be with switching. As I said earlier, you can just move the existing switch to the inside location. You only need one new one: OPEN-[OFF]-CLOSE (momentary?) operator with two N.O. and two N.C. modules. May have to get a different type or add an extension ring to the box, so it'll fit in the box.
 
GoldDigger said:
Since they are key switches, one way to minimize the chance of a conflict will be to use the key like a Kirk-key.
"Archive" all but one of the keys and use that one for both switches.
Q1: Is the switch momentary with return to center?
Q2: Do you hold the switch in open or close position and let limit switches stop the motor or do you just start the cover moving and then release?


Tapatalk!
Click to expand...


I believe the building code requires a person to be at the switch when opening and closing so it has to be momentary contact.
 
GoldDigger...the switch is on stop (center) position always until user turns to either close or open position. Let go of the key and motor stops...because the key springs back to the center position. Limits are in place to stop the cover at the full open position and full closed position.
 
drblkjk said:
GoldDigger...the switch is on stop (center) position always until user turns to either close or open position. Let go of the key and motor stops...because the key springs back to the center position. Limits are in place to stop the cover at the full open position and full closed position.
Click to expand...


That is what is called a momentary contact switch-- a doorbell pushbutton is another type of momentary contact switch. If you think about it you don't want someone to close the pool cover and walk away while it is closing in case someone falls in or something to that matter
 
My electrical contractor said it should be straight forward, but I should check with a higher authority...he is not familiar with these switches and he really told me to figure it out and he will install it.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I wasn't sure if my customer needed a 200A service so I told him to do the load calcs and I would install it. :eek:hmy:

And since when did this become a DIY forum?

-Hal
 
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