Preforming my first live service changeout

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peter d

peter d

Senior Member
Location
New England
mxslick said:
Life without risk is not life, it is sitting around like a lump. If someone is so unwilling to take risks, they should just stay home in bed 24/7.
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:roll:

I believe that life is about mitigating unnecessary risk. In the case of live work, as Bob has said, it's not worth my life or my health.

To those who feel manly and strong because you do live work, knock your socks off. Have at it. You can jump right into that live gear and land those feeders. Take that cover off that 480 volt panel. Never mind that many that have done those very tasks have been killed or injured as a result.

On this issue I believe there are those who get it and those who don't. Thankfully watching a few arc flash videos on YouTube was enough for me to get it. :cool:
 
mxslick

mxslick

Senior Member
Location
SE Idaho
peter d said:
:roll:

I believe that life is about mitigating unnecessary risk. In the case of live work, as Bob has said, it's not worth my life or my health.

To those who feel manly and strong because you do live work, knock your socks off. Have at it. You can jump right into that live gear and land those feeders. Take that cover off that 480 volt panel. Never mind that many that have done those very tasks have been killed or injured as a result.

On this issue I believe there are those who get it and those who don't. Thankfully watching a few arc flash videos on YouTube was enough for me to get it. :cool:
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The key is mitigating the risk...thus I am of the opinion that with proper training and PPE it IS possible to work live with a reasonable degree of safety.

And don't lose sight of what we are supposed to be talking about here, which was a reconnect of a residential service drop, NOT landing live feeders or working on 480 volt services, even I'm not THAT crazy.

Before this thing got into deeper discussion, seems that there are a lot of folks on here who have done the reconnect task and agree that it's not a big deal if proper precautions are taken.

To the position that many have done the task and been injured or killed, I can agree, but on the flip side many more have done the task WITHOUT injury or death. Under current rules and laws is that acceptable? If not a one-man shop of course not.

Like any statistic, one can state the numbers to suit one's own desired result. One can argue that live work causes way too many deaths and injuries, and one can show that based on the TOTAL number of electricians doing the work the death and injury rate is quite low. (Not that ANY death or injury is acceptable, but come on, be realistic, ANYONE doing ANY job can get hurt or killed. I know of people who have suffered serious injuries and a few deaths working on cinema equipment.)

And I have seen and posted links to many of the arc flash videos and I do get it.....did you happen to notice that in the vast majority of those videos the persons involved were NOT wearing PPE? Of course in those cases you're gonna get hurt..or worse.

And did you read the opening post of my thread "Share Your Arc Flash Stories" in the Safety section? I am far from perfect and have made mistakes in the past, have learned from them and that is why I want to seek more training so I do not repeat those same mistakes.

I'm glad we have these discussions because I do like the fact that despite differences of opinions we can all learn from each other. :grin:
 
iwire

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
Tony, all you have convinced me of is you want to work hot because you like to take risks.

Knock yourself out but do not try to encourage others to follow in doing something that 90% of the time is against the law.
 
jumper

jumper

Senior Member
Location
3 Hr 2 Min from Winged Horses
KP2 said:
After following this thread I have a different view on this topic then I did a few weeks ago.

Every time I have done a live cut and tap I would call my wife and give her a heads up that I was about to reconnect and if I didn't call in about a half hour she should call me and if I didn't answer call 911 and send them to the job.

I usaully worked alone in the first few years of being in buisness. Then when I hired a helper I would explain to him to pull the ladder out if I get hung up and can't let go.

The old saying I was told when taught in school how to live cut and tap was "It's unfused so you FRY till you DIE." No go up and becarful.

I never thought it was dangerous when I did the work but reflecting back on what I my back up plan's; wait a half hour and check in, or let me fall 15 to 2? feet.

Not a very good safety plan is it??:-?
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Nope, but then I would say most of us have did similar things like this in the past.

I have done that "back up plan with phone and wife". She never said a word at the time. Years later we talked about it and she told me that she will probably never forgive me for the terror I put her through while she waited to find out if I was still alive.

You say that you have a different view now, I hope that means that you agree that working hot, when it is not necessary, is not worth it.
 
peter d

peter d

Senior Member
Location
New England
mxslick said:
And don't lose sight of what we are supposed to be talking about here, which was a reconnect of a residential service drop, NOT landing live feeders or working on 480 volt services, even I'm not THAT crazy.
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I have reconnected live residential service drops with PPE but I never felt safe nor comfortable doing it. The fact remains is that the task is very hazardous and is often done on a ladder which also includes a fall hazard if something goes wrong.

Furthermore don't make it sound like it's "just" a residential service drop. What if there's only 30 or 40 feet of overhead span connected right to the transformer? Tremendous fault current available there, unfused no less.
 
peter d

peter d

Senior Member
Location
New England
KP2 said:
In the quoted thread I agreed with how Denis peformed a live cut and tap.

I called CL&P (the POCO were I am in CT) and they said thier proceedure is to keep the service grounded as long as possible.

I also learned that CL&P will come to the job and disconnect the service drop from the street, and give a call back contact person to call when we are done and they will come out that day and reconnect. All with no charge to the EC or the home owner. And usaully can set up an appt. with 5 days of calling.

CL&P will also remove the drop all together for tree work and put it back after the tree is down.:cool:
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This is good to know. I am licensed in CT and sometimes do work there. I am glad the poco is now taking some responsibility for this to make our work much safer. Now, I wish National Grid would follow suit.
 
K

KP2

Senior Member
Location
New Milford, CT
jumper said:
Nope, but then I would say most of us have did similar things like this in the past.

I have done that "back up plan with phone and wife". She never said a word at the time. Years later we talked about it and she told me that she will probably never forgive me for the terror I put her through while she waited to find out if I was still alive.

You say that you have a different view now, I hope that means that you agree that working hot, when it is not necessary, is not worth it.
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My wife to, she hated when I said I got another service upgrade to do.

And yes about working hot. It's not worth it.

I am older and wiser now and I can't belive all the risk's I took in the past.
 
USMC1302

USMC1302

Senior Member
Location
NW Indiana
From the majority of the responses here, it really does seem that attitudes toward safety are changing. I do respect differing opinions although the regs say what they say. I am still amazed by that video of the This Old House episode someone posted awhile back. That sure doesn't help educate the average customer. Thanks again to Iwire, Larry Fine and all the regulars. Great site to learn.
 
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