I am looking at a project where the original install shows a freezer 208V and two 120V-20A duplex outlets from a small sub-panel and the panel also has a branch circuit to a outdoor receptacle, when they lose power they plug in a small generator to the receptacle to back-feed the panel to keep the freezer running? my concern is how do you ground a system like this I thought you could not connect a portable generator to a premise wiring system? I did not see a ground rod near the outdoor receptacle but assume you would need something to ground the frame to at least? I will try to get a picture next time I am out there.
questionable install?
- Thread starter Mike01
- Start date
- Status
- Location
- Massachusetts
There is no code compliant, power company compliant, safe way to backfeed a receptacle with a generator.
They need a proper 'inlet' and transfer means.
Do not do what they are asking, you could kill linemen.
They need a proper 'inlet' and transfer means.
Do not do what they are asking, you could kill linemen.
charlie
Senior Member
- Location
- Indianapolis
- Location
- Lockport, IL
- Occupation
- Semi-Retired Electrical Engineer
And just in case your client might be thinking that the ?you could kill linemen? statement is a mere ?the sky is falling? exaggeration, let me invite your attention to,
? 406.6(B) ? the prongs of a cord are not allowed to be energized except by being inserted into a receptacle, and you can?t energize a receptacle by inserting a plug, and
? 702.6, last paragraph and the exception ? you must use transfer equipment, and your client?s situation does not meet the exception.
? 406.6(B) ? the prongs of a cord are not allowed to be energized except by being inserted into a receptacle, and you can?t energize a receptacle by inserting a plug, and
? 702.6, last paragraph and the exception ? you must use transfer equipment, and your client?s situation does not meet the exception.
winnie
Senior Member
- Location
- Springfield, MA, USA
- Occupation
- Electric motor research
Note that with small changes, this could be a proper install.
1) Proper transfer means could be as simple as a mechanical interlock system between the main breaker of the panel and the 'generator breaker'.
2) A proper 'inlet' can be had that mounts as easily as an ordinary receptacle. The inlet will have prongs sticking out rather than slots for the prongs to go into.
3) The transfer means does not switch the EGC, and does not need to switch the neutral. The building ground system can provide grounding and bonding for the generator.
-Jon
1) Proper transfer means could be as simple as a mechanical interlock system between the main breaker of the panel and the 'generator breaker'.
2) A proper 'inlet' can be had that mounts as easily as an ordinary receptacle. The inlet will have prongs sticking out rather than slots for the prongs to go into.
3) The transfer means does not switch the EGC, and does not need to switch the neutral. The building ground system can provide grounding and bonding for the generator.
-Jon
HotConductor
Senior Member
- Location
- Philadelphia
300 bucks - problem solved
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200321033_200321033
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200321033_200321033
Cow
Senior Member
- Location
- Eastern Oregon
- Occupation
- Electrician
There's really no reason not to do this right. An interlockkit is only 150 dollars.
www.interlockkit.com
www.interlockkit.com
this is very simple to fix. Replace the subpanel with one of these square D jobs http://www.squared.com/us/applications/residential.nsf/LookupFiles/GeneratorPanels2005.pdf/$file/GeneratorPanels2005.pdfthey can be had for a bit over $100 if i recall. Then use an inlet like this http://www.electricgeneratorsdirect.com/Midwest-Electric-U030ND/p1030.html
LarryFine
Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
- Location
- Henrico County, VA
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
Guru, you don't even need to pay $100. You can buy the rocker interlock and assemble your own panel for about half of that. I've made whole-house panels that way for smaller homes.
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