Raceway question

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guschash

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Is it permissible to use a abandoned closthes shoot as a raceway, its line with metal. I need to get to the attic and this would be convenent raceway. This is a mutifamily dwelling.
 
I would imagine that there wouldn't be any problem with using it as a location to string a listed cable assembly (such NM-B or MC) or a listed raceway (such as FMC), but you cannot use an unlisted raceway for individual conductors (e.g., THHN).

Reference:

300.3 (A) Single Conductors. Single conductors specified in Table 310.13(A) shall only be installed where part of a recognized wiring method of Chapter 3.
 
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The Pi master has it right. Cables are fine, individual conductors would need to be in an approved raceway. The only issue may be supporting the cables. That would need to be determined as the whether or not they were fished or if they could possibly be supported and secured.
 
guschash said:
Is it permissible to use a abandoned closthes shoot as a raceway, its line with metal. I need to get to the attic and this would be convenent raceway. This is a mutifamily dwelling.
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Permissible or not, I don't recommend it. To me it says "Hack!".

I have seen more than a few laundry chutes converted into raceways, including one in my house (done before I bought it). Every time I see it I cringe and sigh for the lack of craft.
 
lordofpi said:
This is when you send one of your really skinny apprentices in there armed with an NM staple-gun and lots of butter.
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-= That just ain't right =-




:grin:
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ceknight said:
Permissible or not, I don't recommend it. To me it says "Hack!".
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Then I am a hack. :grin:

I have used an abandoned laundry chute to run phone, cable and feeders from the basement up in a 15 story building.

As long as the customer is OK with it I do not see why it is 'hack'.

Would it be better to tear up walls or run surface?
 
ceknight said:
Permissible or not, I don't recommend it. To me it says "Hack!".

I have seen more than a few laundry chutes converted into raceways, including one in my house (done before I bought it). Every time I see it I cringe and sigh for the lack of craft.
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I just dont see the hack in this method, it's saving someone time and money, it's really no different then working in a house with balloon framing.
 
An abandoned laundry chute or trash chute is functionally no different than a chase installed purposely in a building for that purpose. A very economic way to fish cable, and it makes good sense to me.
 
iwire said:
I have used an abandoned laundry chute to run phone, cable and feeders from the basement up in a 15 story building.
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If I had to get 15 floors up, I'd be using the chute too. :) And if the chute has been truly abandoned, as in sealed off from the habitable space in a house that may not be a candidate for future restoration, then even then I might go for it.

But the ones I've seen weren't so much abandoned as they were just unused. They didn't have the doors sealed off, they had sharp metal edges at the basement exit with cable stapled to the joist then unsupported in the chute. If there are kids about who like to play with laundry chutes, then you have an accident waiting to happen. One good yank on that cable and the cable risks losing its magic smoke.
 
ceknight said:
And if the chute has been truly abandoned, as in sealed off from the habitable space in a house that may not be a candidate for future restoration, then even then I might go for it.

But the ones I've seen weren't so much abandoned as they were just unused. They didn't have the doors sealed off, ...
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You'd have to show me that requirement in some model code before I'd agree with that one. An unused laundry chute is abandoned the same as one that is sealed off, since no model code contains the definition of an abandoned space.
 
mdshunk said:
You'd have to show me that requirement in some model code before I'd agree with that one..
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You don't have to agree with it. I'm not citing code, I'm expressing an opinion. :)

As I noted earlier, I live in a house that had an unused laundry chute used as a raceway. I also had kids who loved to play with it. As in "it became a used chute". When I finally pulled that cable out, the insulation was damaged where it entered the chute and it was clearly stressed where it hit the box in the attic, too. That pup had been pulled on, hard.

If you don't mind installing unsupported cables in places where kids have easy access and can play with them because there's not a fine enough distinction in the model code, more power to you. I just don't happen to like it. :)
 
guschash said:
Is it permissible to use a abandoned closthes shoot as a raceway, its line with metal. I need to get to the attic and this would be convenent raceway. This is a mutifamily dwelling.
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Although I agree as others have stated,that it does not it does not appear to be a code violation. My concern is that the chase would cause a chimney effect in the event of a fire. I hope that you are firestopping at the top and the bottom with an approved method.
 
DUCKMAN said:
My concern is that the chase would cause a chimney effect in the event of a fire. .
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That is a valid concern, which will be the case whether or not cables are installed in that abandoned chute.
 
iwire said:
I have used an abandoned laundry chute to run phone, cable and feeders from the basement up in a 15 story building.
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With that tall a structure, wouldn't you need to fire-stop it every so often?
 
ceknight said:
But the ones I've seen weren't so much abandoned as they were just unused. They didn't have the doors sealed off, they had sharp metal edges at the basement exit with cable stapled to the joist then unsupported in the chute. If there are kids about who like to play with laundry chutes, then you have an accident waiting to happen. One good yank on that cable and the cable risks losing its magic smoke.
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Well that's a horse of a different color. Not what we would consider abanonded. If EC just drops wire in w/o proper supports and protection, then I might lean more towards the thought of "hack." But an available chase will always be my first approach.


lordofpi said:
This is when you send one of your really skinny apprentices in there armed with an NM staple-gun and lots of butter.
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I used to be that guy. :grin:
 
360Youth said:
I used to be that guy. :grin:
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Heh, I wish I still could be that guy. There's about 1,000 pit stops at Burger King between me and that guy.

As an aside, given the [lack of] specifics of this situation, I would suggest stringing EMT or Greenfield and pulling in all necessary circuits to supply a 2100 box in the attic (or pull in feeders for another panel in the attic). That way, you eliminate the problems with possible metal abrasion or even the re-opening of the chute that some suggested you may have with NM-B. Reference 358.30(A), Exception No. 2 and 348.30(A), Exception no. 1 for unsupported raceway in concealed spaces.
 
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