Fair point. I was about to say I don't ever see anything in a Dining Room other than a table and a chandelier, haha.But around The Holidays, you push the table up to the wall, plug in assorted warming trays, chafing dishes, and crock pots for the party. That's why the dining room needs some extra 'oomph' in the outlets.
I'm going to recommend it, but right now he just wants to swap out the old cloth wiring in the unit and re wire it because it's all on a few 15A circuits and he's got window A/C units upwards of 10,000 btus, etc.This is a good chance to sell customer a panel switch out.
That is a possible solution. Problem is I have to keep lighting off this circuit or it violates SABC requirements, but that's an interesting thought. Thanks Larry.One could also put the fridge on an SABC that supplies only non-counter kitchen receptacles.
Fair point that plugging something in to a receptacle is more likely to cause a failure than the lighting circuit being entirely on its' own.Having lived in a house with dining light and kitchen light on receptacle circuit and being in the dark, I always separate lights and receptacles.
When was the last time a lighting circuit "blew a fuse" and left you in the dark? It has always been a plugged in object that caused the failure in my life.
Except when it doesn't -- say, while hosting a late-summer picnic with five people preparing food and fifty people drinking beer. The refrigerator door might never close, there might be a lot of small appliances in use and it might be 90° in the kitchen.... The refrigerator runs occasionally. ...
Jim, I'm simply trying to conserve as much of the Kitchen Counter Top SABC's as possible. As stated in the OP, I've encountered coffee makers that pull upwards of 15A, so in my mind, conserving as much of those circuits as possible is the ideal outcome.How often are these circuits tripping and leaving people in the dark?
The refrigerator runs occasionally. I don't see the issue sharing one of the SABC.
I agree with the practice of separation, because I understand why. One wouldn't want to be plunged into sudden darkness at the moment the hot appliance in front of them decided to take out the circuit.I'm curious, what are your thoughts about the dining room light never being connected to the receptacles in the room due to SABC requirements?
In a way, you're setting up for the inconvenience/hazard you're trying to avoid. With separate lighting and receptacle circuits, you have two separate sources of power for lighting in each room or other area.I've honestly never been one to be keen about the idea of separating lighting and receptacles. Having all the lighting on a couple circuits bugs me because if those circuits trip, you're in the dark in an emergency.
I don't see the difficulty with "main floor lighting" or "middle floor bedroom receptacles", etc. As for cleaner panels, It makes no real difference, as the quantity of circuits would be almost the same either way.I think it makes for a cleaner panel and easier to locate OCPD in the event of an emergency.
I don't see anything that makes it non-compliant. SABC's are allowed to have refrigeration equipment on them, not required to. As long as the SABC requirements in the kitchen are met, hooking it up to the general purpose lighting circuit seems like a compliant option... but it's entirely possible I'm missing something.I don't believe that is a compliant option.
See post #9 - (two options for the fridge)I don't see anything that makes it non-compliant. SABC's are allowed to have refrigeration equipment on them, not required to. As long as the SABC requirements in the kitchen are met, hooking it up to the general purpose lighting circuit seems like a compliant option... but it's entirely possible I'm missing something.
I suppose if you include the fridge outlet in with the phrasing "all wall and floor receptacles in the kitchen shall be fed by the SABC" it would be non-compliant.
The issue is limited number of circuits (12) and no panel upgrade to happen any time soon. It's doable. I'm just trying to figure out the best way to distribute the loads.Speaking as a customer, I surprised the electrician during our kitchen remodel by insisting on a dedicated outlet for the refrigerator, and then another dedicated outlet for the counter top microwave (1200 watts). I don't remember now if I wound up with 3 SABC's in the kitchen or if the microwave wound up as one of the two. If the sparky is pulling back to the panel anyway, it's hardly any more trouble to pull another circuit, or even two.