residential portables generators

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mtnelectrical

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Essex, New Jersey
I had a call from a customer saying he would buy another PG the one he has now it is only 3000W and he wants to add more coverage with another PG. Now he is tired of all the extension cords and ask to install Xfer Switches for both of them. Have you ever got this set up before? thanks for your responses
 
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mtnelectrical said:
I had a call from a customer saying he would buy another PG the one he has now it is only 3000W and he wants to add more coverage with another PG. Now he is tired of all the extension cords and ask to install Xfer Switches for both of them. Have you ever got this set up before? thanks for your responses
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I would tell the customer to sell the one he has and buy a larger portable generator.
2 generators, 2 manual transfer switches, 2 panels and all the headaches that would go with moving circuits around
for each generator will cost way more than 1- 200 amp manual transfer switch in front of his existing panel (adjacent thereto) with a portable generator power inlet connected to the emergency side.
 
mtnelectrical said:
Maybe I didn't make myself clear. The customer wants 2 Portables Genns with 2 transfer switches from the same service. (same panelboard) Have you ever seen this set up before?
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No. that would never work if he wanted to run them both at the same time. They would never parallel.
You would need 1 panel per generator and transfer switch.
 
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qcroanoke said:
No. that would never work if he wanted to run them both at the same time. They would never parallel.
You would need 1 panel per generator and transfer switch.
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Sure you could make this work. You set up two separate manual transfer switches and set up the individual loads the way you want. When power goes out, flip the switches and hook up the two portable gennies. Away you go.
 
gadfly56 said:
Sure you could make this work. You set up two separate manual transfer switches and set up the individual loads the way you want. When power goes out, flip the switches and hook up the two portable gennies. Away you go.
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QUOTE[Maybe I didn't make myself clear. The customer wants 2 Portables Genns with 2 transfer switches from the same service. (same panelboard) Have you ever seen this set up before?]QUOTE

I don't see how if he is only using 1 panel.
 
mtnelectrical said:
I had a call from a customer saying he would buy another PG the one he has now it is only 3000W and he wants to add more coverage with another PG. Now he is tired of all the extension cords and ask to install Xfer Switches for both of them. Have you ever got this set up before? thanks for your responses
Click to expand...

Something like this?

DSCN3751.jpg
 
mtnelectrical said:
Maybe I didn't make myself clear. The customer wants 2 Portables Genns with 2 transfer switches from the same service. (same panelboard) Have you ever seen this set up before?
Click to expand...

well that dog isn't gonna hunt....
the honda 2kw and 3 kw gennies have a sync cord so you
can run them together, on a common load, but
the phase shift when you close the second gennie
in is going to be anywhere from zero degrees
(not very likely) to 180 degrees... but most likely
somewhere in the middle.... and current flow
between the gensets will be infinite until a breaker
opens on one genset, or the phases get adjusted so
they are in phase.

unless there is a transfer switch listed and capable
of managing and syncing two different sources, this
won't work.
 
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I think the Hondas are the inverter type, so they sync easier. But I think the op is meaning two separate transfer switches along with two separate sub panels.
 
hillbilly1 said:
I think the Hondas are the inverter type, so they sync easier. But I think the op is meaning two separate transfer switches along with two separate sub panels.
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well, what he said....

"Maybe I didn't make myself clear. The customer wants 2 Portables
Genns with 2 transfer switches from the same service. (same panelboard)
Have you ever seen this set up before?"

sounds like the man wants to feed a common bus...

the slick thing to do would be to have a transfer switch that
would pull in the second genset when needed, sync, them, and shed it
when not needed..... i've not seen anything that cool for a residential application.

when they tie big generators to the grid in powerhouses, they match them
within a degree or so, iirc. before closing.... once they are closed, the
electrical coupling is as strong as a driveshaft, and if one can't keep up, it relays out.
 
Fulthrotl said:
well, what he said....

"Maybe I didn't make myself clear. The customer wants 2 Portables
Genns with 2 transfer switches from the same service. (same panelboard)
Have you ever seen this set up before?"

sounds like the man wants to feed a common bus...

the slick thing to do would be to have a transfer switch that
would pull in the second genset when needed, sync, them, and shed it
when not needed..... i've not seen anything that cool for a residential application.

when they tie big generators to the grid in powerhouses, they match them
within a degree or so, iirc. before closing.... once they are closed, the
electrical coupling is as strong as a driveshaft, and if one can't keep up, it relays out.
Click to expand...

I take it as 2 transfer switches FEED from the same service, I could be wrong though. It's happened a few times before!:roll:
 
qcroanoke said:
That would work! But I think a lot of money was spent right there and they still have an FPE panel.
Click to expand...

But there is probably hardly any breakers left in the FPE besides the main and the feeder to the transfer switches that are carrying any load:happyyes:

If this guy wants to run two generators, he only needs to be without power for a few days and he may spend enough extra on fuel to have purchased the larger generator in the first place.
 
The problem with multiple gennys is that you need them to be 'in time' with each other. There are two approaches to this problem.

Approach #1 is what is shown in that picture with the lovely FPE panel: manual transfer switches that interrupt specific circuits. These don't energize the buss of the panel at all; there's OCPD's for each circuit in the transfer switch.

Approach #2 is somewhat more elegant. SOME of your better gennys are designed to be hooked up in pairs, and somehow synch with each other automatically. This would provide you with more watts, so you might be able to place your transfer switch on the feed to the panel.
 
Wouldn't the necessary equipment to sync the two generators cost more than getting a larger generator in the first place?
 
We don' need no steenkin' sync

We don' need no steenkin' sync

Why is anyone talking about sync? If you have two manual transfer switches, or even ATS's, each genny feeds separate load centers even though the load centers are fed from the same panel. Nothing goes back through the panel; "Never the twain shall meet". Don't make it more complicated than necessary.
 
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