Running 12/4 to kitchens

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Dansos

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I figured I would throw it out there for some feedback. Does anyone see a problem running a 12/4 romex from the panel to a junction box in the basement under the kitchen and breaking off into 2 12/2 feeds for kitchen GFCI’s??
 
You would be better off running 12/3 for a multiwire branch circuit, or 12/2/2. 12/4 is going to have 3 Hots and a neutral, and you cannot re-identify a hot as a neutral, and it's somewhat unlikely you would need the third hot as a switched conductor.

Eta: if the kitchen circuits need to be afci as well, you may be better off with two runs of 12 2 Romex. It's probably cheaper (less than half) than 12 /4 or 12/2/2 anyway.
 
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12-2-2 will have you covered. Might save $$$$ on labor depending on how its priced. I'm curious what the prices are on 12-2-2.
 
I would never burden a new construction home with a J-box in a basement that someday may become a problem for someone wanting to finish the basement.
 
We have used 12/2/2 for long homeruns in the past. IMO it's a good idea to get two circuits from one cable.
 
250’ of 12/2/2 from distributor is around $200. I have thought about 12/3 for dual circuits but worry about a shared neutral. We mainly rewire older homes so half of our battle is running wires through a basement full of steam pipes and/or water lines. Running 1 wire for 2 feeds, even if wire is more expensive, will greatly impact labor costs.
 
Dansos said:
250’ of 12/2/2 from distributor is around $200.
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That's definitely more than two rolls of 12-2.
We mainly rewire older homes so half of our battle is running wires through a basement full of steam pipes and/or water lines. Running 1 wire for 2 feeds, even if wire is more expensive, will greatly impact labor costs.
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Tape the ends of two 12-2s and pull them together. There's labor in the extra J-boxes for multi-circuit cable, too.
 
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I used 12/2/2 years back when I first noticed it at the part house. Never could get it to work out economically.
 
texie said:
I would never burden a new construction home with a J-box in a basement that someday may become a problem for someone wanting to finish the basement.
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I would set a 2 Gang adjustable box half inch off of the joist, facing down, so that if sheetrock were ever added, all they would have is a cover plate in the ceiling. No need to move electrical or bury a junction box. And I would go with the adjustable just in case they add furring strips and the drywall is an inch or inch and a quarter down from the floor joist. I would also run the wire up in the joist and drill where necessary so that a ceiling could be added later on without moving wiring.

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As mentioned, pulling two 12 / 2 NM cables at once is simply a matter of having two rolls on hand, or pulling a length off of one roll, taping it to the roll then pulling two cables at once off of 1 250 (or 100) foot piece.

A multiwire branch circuit will have less voltage drop than two 12/2 cables. The 12 / 2 / 2 saves a little bit of time in that you only have to deal with one ground wire, you wouldn't have to rig two cables, and you don't have to worry about share neutrals or 2 Pole Breakers or handle ties.

Eta: if the homeowner is thinking about adding things in the future, and the panel will be hard to get to, do yourself a huge favor and run an extra 12 / 3 and 14 / 3 to the basement and to the Attic. That will give you 8 potential extra circuits in the future with wire that you probably would have thrown away anyway. If they even have once mention the word Spa, go ahead and run a piece of 1 inch ENT to the basement
 
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How much time does it save? We run 2 runs at a time, especially in the kitchen. 12/2/2 needs a large jb when you have 2- 12/2 cables also. I would never have a blank plate showing and I don't like the idea of a jb in the crawl in a new home,
 
12-2-2 debuted shortly after afci's ,which didn't like multiwire circuits.

But then GE invented a way around that

What i do like is the 14-2-2 , not the 'two circuit', but the 3 hots, 1 noodle stuff , i'm getting one less box fill conductor, and the (recently) required noodle for every switch


~RJ~
 
Dansos said:
I figured I would throw it out there for some feedback. Does anyone see a problem running a 12/4 romex from the panel to a junction box in the basement under the kitchen and breaking off into 2 12/2 feeds for kitchen GFCI’s??
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Is 12/4 12AWG 4 core?
If not, what?
 
LarryFine said:
Price comparison?

100' of 12-2
50' of 12-2-2
50' of 12-3
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Just out or curiosity, I went to the online orange big box ... Easter Sunday;

not the quantities you requested however, full rolls

250' of 12-2, $70.97
250' of 12-2-2, $206.18
250' of 12-3, $136.33
 
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