Shared neutrals used anymore?

[brother]

Just curious do any of you use shared neutrals anymore since it looks like most new circuits dont get them now, (especially emergency circuits)? I still see use for them in old buildings where you have existing conduit in slabs and its easier and quicker and diffinetly cost effective to use shared neutral to be able to use the existing pipe. on normal covient circuits. . I generally dont like them, but I do still see the use for them.

 

[ptonsparky]

Every service entrance. Almost Every feeder. Occasional branch circuits, but not many now.

 

[brother]

Every service entrance. Almost Every feeder. Occasional branch circuits, but not many now.

maybe i need to clarify, I am referring to branch circuits.

 

[LarryFine]

I still do when I can.

 

[ActionDave]

I still use them every chance I get but most job specs say no shared neutrals.

 

[roger]

Same here, every chance I can.

Roger

 

[Fred B]

So how do you get around AFCI requirements, most dont like MWBC?

 

[ptonsparky]

So how do you get around AFCI requirements, most dont like MWBC?

AFCI are limited to residential settings at the moment.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

In commercial work you will see multiwire branch circuit but you don't see them much anymore in residential work.

 

[winnie]

DIY report, but as soon as I realized that double pole afci breakers were available for the panel in my home, I went back to MWBC wiring.

Jon

 

[LarryFine]

So how do you get around AFCI requirements, most dont like MWBC?

By living and working where we're still on the 2014 NEC.

 

[jap]

DIY report, but as soon as I realized that double pole afci breakers were available for the panel in my home, I went back to MWBC wiring.

Jon

Doesn't that just needlessly create a "Trouble in one circuit shut down two" situation?

JAP>

 

[curt swartz]

By living and working where we're still on the 2014 NEC.

How does using the 2014 NEC get you out of AFCI requirements in most locations?

 

[LarryFine]

How does using the 2014 NEC get you out of AFCI requirements in most locations?

Allow me to rephrase: I have only installed AFCI breakers in new construction on bedroom outlets as of yet.

 

[roger]

Doesn't that just needlessly create a "Trouble in one circuit shut down two" situation?

JAP>

A MWBC is one circuit period. You simply tell the occupant you are turning off the circuit and it will kill a lot of lights and receptacles. Of course you can work it hot since the CMP put us in this situation.

Roger

 

[electrofelon]

I too use MWBC's all the time. Just pulled lots of 120/208 full boats, usually 2 or 3 in a 3/4. A tip:. 3 single pole breakers with handle tie is much cheaper than 1 three pole breaker. Siemens does not make a three pole handle tie unfortunately, but Eaton does. Also with the handle tie you can remove it down the road for safer independent operation. IMO the handle tie requirement was one of the worst code changes and has greatly increased hazards. On this job I'll be removing all the handle ties after inspection.

 

[James L]

By living and working where we're still on the 2014 NEC.

Most municipalities around KCMO are still on 2011 which requires afci in all dwelling type rooms and areas. There's one munipality here, can't remember which one, which amended to only require bedrooms

KCMO proper, and a couple others, are 2017.

I don't remember knowing about any on 2014

 

[James L]

I too use MWBC's all the time. Just pulled lots of 120/208 full boats, usually 2 or 3 in a 3/4. A tip:. 3 single pole breakers with handle tie is much cheaper than 1 three pole breaker. Siemens does not make a three pole handle tie unfortunately, but Eaton does. Also with the handle tie you can remove it down the road for safer independent operation. IMO the handle tie requirement was one of the worst code changes and has greatly increased hazards. On this job I'll be removing all the handle ties after inspection.

I wired a restaurant last year, and bought handle ties for all my 2-and 3-pole mwbc. Eaton panels.

When I got final inspection, the AHJ noted that I didn't have many single pole breakers, and asked what gives. So I explained to him that I handle-tied my mwbc.

Him: what did you do that for?
Me: 'cause it's required
Him: not here
Me: ok....so....ima take 'em off...?
Him: I would

Done

 

[Dennis Alwon]

A MWBC is one circuit period.
Roger

Not sure I agree. The bold appears to suggest it is one circuit only in section 225.30

225.30 Number of Supplies. A building or other structure
that is served by a branch circuit or feeder on the load side of a
service disconnecting means shall be supplied by only one
feeder or branch circuit unless permitted in 225.30(A)
through (E). For the purpose of this section, a multiwire
branch circuit shall be considered a single circuit.

 

[ptonsparky]

As much as I used MWBC in the past, there is no way I would remove required handle ties. They aren’t there for those of us that grew up with, them. Remove if you want while trouble shooting but put them back. That next kid may not have the slightest.
Some area ECs were installing AFCIs then taking them out after inspection. Grrr.