something needs to be done .

[iaov]

You can also 'murder your family' with a car used stupidly. We will never be able to stop stupid.

I do not want amatures working on my teeth or removing my appendix, but we are not taking about home owners hiring amatures to work on their home, we are talking about homeowners right to work on their own home. And if those same homeowners also want to remove their own appendix I am fine with that as well,:smile:

LOL. I would enjoy watching that opperation! And you are absolutely right Bob, unfortunatly,we cannot regulate stupidity.

 

[480sparky]

That's not very reassuring, either. :roll:

You don't do HO inspections?

 

[drbond24]

Has anyone else notice that weekenders have expanded there lack of branch circuit knowledge to service work. Went to a job to snake a circuit ( cant teach that online or at the depot ) . went to cut in the circuit , the panel had been changed . It couldn't have been done by anyone who had any basic electrical knowledge, they left out the main breaker. its upsetting me when I go to a job and tell the homeowner that they have code violations that are dangerous and need to be corrected and i get . its been that way for awhile and never had any problems . We need an awareness program through or with insurance providers. Any thoughts ?

People can do what they want. If you found a code violation in my house, it is my choice whether I pay you to fix it or not. That would never happen, though, because I've never hired an electrician.

This has been covered before because one of you guys came up with an impressive string of adjectives denouncing my do-it-yourself work at my house, but I continue to do it. It is my choice to do so. I understand that you guys need work, but as has already been pointed out, where does it stop? Do you want me calling you to change lightbulbs? Hang Christmas lights? Install solar powered landscaping lights? Then I would need a plumber to take a bath or wash dishes, a carpenter and a mason to light my fireplace (wood and brick ), ... I could go on, but I've already run it into the ground.

Bottom line, you're just going to have to deal with people like me. We're stubborn. :roll:

 

[Rockyd]

But of course no one wants to pay for that many inspectors... and around we go

My state only has two electrical inspectors for the whole state. In fairness to transpearency, Anchorage has it's own city inspector's (four) as well as Fairbanks. Just trying to keep the government local...
"Caveat emptor" definitely takes on whole new meaning. Buying things in Alaska is up to the individual, as are the risks, rewards, and failures. Wonder how America in the "lower 48", would do with that concept?

 

[satcom]

Yes, I agree something needs to be done, and it is not stoping homeowners from doing their own work, rather, they need to inforce existing laws requiring an inspection, in cities that require them. that will not be a cure all but a good start.

If a homeowner wants to destroy their own home, they do it bad wiring, or a chain saw, it is their home.

 

[cowboyjwc]

Cute but the Ark is a myth. Amatuers did not send men to the moon,discover penecilan,build a circuit breaker or an aircraft carrier,etc.,etc.I'm always a little surprized that a forum that I believe has some of the top proffesionals in the country as members, is always so eager to discount the work of proffesionals. I don't know about you guys but I don't want an amatuer working on my teeth, removing my appendix, or even fixing my roof.I amk also a bit amazed by the fact that I cannot murder my family with a gun but its OK to do it with a 14/2 wire and a 50 amp breaker.

Actually amatuers did send men to the moon, they had to be amatuers by definition simply because they had never done it before. Someone has to be operated on by the surgon doing his first operation.

I work for the government and I want the government to stay out of my house. I think that what you do between your fences should be up to you. Here they tell you how much and what kind of landscaping you have to have in your front yard, where you can place your pool or shed, how many dogs or cats you can have, that you have to park your car on a paved surface even if you have a 10 foot wide side yard.

If someone wants to do their own work on their house, we don't care, but we do hold them to the same requirements that you guys or any other contractor have. Permits are still required for certain work and inspetions too. Trust me (like you guys didn't know) that many of you do not get the proper permits or inspections simply because you chose not to, not because you didn't know they were needed.

Like some have questioned, when does it stop? A landscaper is required to be licensed so why should you be able to put in sprinklers and mow your own lawn?

 

[Dr.Sparks]

Cute but the Ark is a myth. Amatuers did not send men to the moon,discover penecilan,build a circuit breaker or an aircraft carrier,etc.,etc.I'm always a little surprized that a forum that I believe has some of the top proffesionals in the country as members, is always so eager to discount the work of proffesionals. I don't know about you guys but I don't want an amatuer working on my teeth, removing my appendix, or even fixing my roof.I amk also a bit amazed by the fact that I cannot murder my family with a gun but its OK to do it with a 14/2 wire and a 50 amp breaker.

I started a thread on this same topic last week after I found a DIY electrical help website.The responses that I got from this forum had me labeled as a communist for not allowing homeowners to do their own electrical work.I was rather disturbed to learn of the mentality of the trained professionals that feel that's ok.Think of the ripple-effect that could come out of a DIY'ers handywork. A fire started by an overloaded circuit(I'm guessing that many DIY'ers don't own ammeters) could potentially injure, burn, or kill anyone in the area-from the child down the street at a sleep over, to the passerby trying to help, the volunteer firefighters.......the list goes on! Where has the pride gone in our industry??It's not about the government telling us what our rights are, it's about safety, responsibility and the pride that we should posess as trained craftsmen.

 

[Fulthrotl]

I rarely come up on situations that are so serious I think it should be fixed no matter what. They usually fix it once I explain it to them. If they refuse, I not only pull out the form, but if it's serious enough, I would either call the building department...

bingo.

it's a story i've posted here before, so i won't repeat all of it, but if i
see a situation where there is an imminent risk to live or property, i will
first try to explain the seriousness to the customer, and if they do not
see the need to correct it IMMEDIATELY, i will explain that i am required
by law, as a licensed professional, to report it to the building department.

i explain that, at that point, i am not trying to generate work, or gouge
excessive profits for unnecessary work, i am taking steps to protect myself
from criminal and civil actions that will be taken against me if i FAIL TO
REPORT an unsafe situation to the proper authorities.

i explain about swimming pools, and district attorneys, and a dead college
girl electrocuted while swimming, and a property owner who went to
prison for manslaughter, in addition to losing everything he owned, at age 60.

i don't have a release form for people to sign. i don't need one.

what i do need is a copy of the code violation report i file at the building
department.

i've never needed one of those either. after the explanation, i've never
had someone refuse to correct the problem. i've never had to file a report
with a city building department.

randy

 

[satcom]

I started a thread on this same topic last week after I found a DIY electrical help website.The responses that I got from this forum had me labeled as a communist for not allowing homeowners to do their own electrical work.I was rather disturbed to learn of the mentality of the trained professionals that feel that's ok.Think of the ripple-effect that could come out of a DIY'ers handywork. A fire started by an overloaded circuit(I'm guessing that many DIY'ers don't own ammeters) could potentially injure, burn, or kill anyone in the area-from the child down the street at a sleep over, to the passerby trying to help, the volunteer firefighters.......the list goes on! Where has the pride gone in our industry??It's not about the government telling us what our rights are, it's about safety, responsibility and the pride that we should posess as trained craftsmen.

"I was rather disturbed to learn of the mentality of the trained professionals that feel that's ok.Think of the ripple-effect that could come out of a DIY'ers handywork."

As professionals most of us understand all the hazzards of DIY work, however we also understand the rights of a homeowner to do their own work, provided they secure all the required permits, in cities where they are required, and have the sense to follow all the laws, so they don't end up with a property loss or even worse a loss of life, and even the possibility of the insurance company not paying a claim, because they din't follow the rules.

 

[electricalperson]

i love it when home owners do there own work. i love it even more when the people at lowes and home depot tell them how to do it. when they screw up there house or put hte service in upside down i make 1000 dollars to go fix it:grin:

kind of a side question. if a licensed electrician got a part time job at home depot in the electrical department as one of the experts can he get introuble for giving advice to people and they get hurt or do it wrong?

 

[peter d]

You say homeowners have a right to work on their home but at the same time you want restricted access to parts.

That will result in people using whatever they can get their hands on or a black market of parts.

Right, and before the age of the big box store was the age of the local hardware store where DIYers plied their trade. Nothing has really changed except the selection for a DIYer is a lot better now. Which is great because I'm a DIYer as well.

 

[ramsy]

People need to remember that we live in a republic ..Good to see captitalism is still alive and well. Home of the free, because of the brave!

Don't forget, congressional lobbyists securing $ trillions for criminal corporations is also alive and well. Perhaps, closer to a plutocracy, Home of the fleeced, because of the naive.

 

[steelersman]

So, how many DIYers worked on the bridge?

On the flip side, professionals built the Titanic.... amateurs built the Ark.

what ark?...

 

[steelersman]

Actually amatuers did send men to the moon, they had to be amatuers by definition simply because they had never done it before. Someone has to be operated on by the surgon doing his first operation.

they were professionals in their field or line of work. I'm sure they weren't amateur rocket scientists and amateur physicists.

I work for the government and I want the government to stay out of my house. I think that what you do between your fences should be up to you. Here they tell you how much and what kind of landscaping you have to have in your front yard, where you can place your pool or shed, how many dogs or cats you can have, that you have to park your car on a paved surface even if you have a 10 foot wide side yard.

Around here, or I should say down the road a few miles in another neighborhood where I moved out of, it's not the govt. telling you what you can and can't have on the outside of your home but it's the HOA (not hand-off-auto but home owners' association) telling you that your deck is the wrong color stain or that you need to paint your columns on your front porch and crap like that every year when they do inspections. Yes these losers actually walk the neighborhood and snoop around looking for "violations" to cite. And all that for the very reasonable price of $270 a quarter. So needless to say I couldn't stand it there so now I'm HOA free. And it feels so good! :grin:

 

[steelersman]

Don't forget, congressional lobbyists securing $ trillions for criminal corporations is also alive and well. Perhaps, closer to a plutocracy, Home of the fleeced, because of the naive.

well said. I like that one!

Some people are so caught up in showing how patriotic they are to the point that it blinds them.

 

[wbalsam1]

what ark?...

If the Ark sprung a leak, would that have been the first Ark-fault? :-?

 

[480sparky]

If the Ark sprung a leak, would that have been the first Ark-fault? :-?

Current would have flowed!

 

[steelersman]

If the Ark sprung a leak, would that have been the first Ark-fault? :-?

what ark?...

 

[480sparky]

what ark?...

what ark?...

Missed Sunday school one day.....?

 

[electricmanscott]

what ark?...

This one....