Speaking of permits..or avoiding them

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electricmanscott

electricmanscott

Senior Member
Location
Boston, MA
Occupation
Massachusetts Master Electrician, one man show.
Another reason to avoid the headaches of permits.

Had inspection set up for 3 pm Tues afternoon. Wait...wait...wait.....4 o'clock now no inspector.

Call office and there he is. "Ran out of time, I'll be there tomorrow....."

Next one...

Buddy calls inspector (different city) Mon aft for Tues inspection. "Call back in the morning" the guy says rather than just set it up then.

He calls in the am...."I can't get out there today" the guy says

So they set it up for this morning. Buddy waits for an hour then goes into the inspectional service office which was right around the corner.

Inspector bagged in sick today. God forbid they call all the people waiting for inspections......

:rolleyes: :mad:
 
not a really good excuse for not wanting permits.
If the AHJ has a missed apoinment rate that is too High then you need to get that taken care of.

Inspectors here are usually on time carry cell phones and a pretty darn good a keeping in touch.
 
Sierrasparky said:
not a really good excuse for not wanting permits.
If the AHJ has a missed apoinment rate that is too High then you need to get that taken care of.

Inspectors here are usually on time carry cell phones and a pretty darn good a keeping in touch.
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It is a perfect excuse for avoiding permits.

Just another in a long list of reasons.

Contractor friendly is NOT how I would describe the way inspectional services operates here unfortunately.
 
avoiding permits can be very costly, depending where you are doing working without a permit can be an unwanted expense

i can see having to meet a contractor if he is the only one who has access to the site, but when I am busy and I get a contractor who wants a time for a new house, why? I don't need him there, its not like I am going to wait while he fixes
corrections
 
i actually apply for very few permits, if I do work for a homeowner I always give them two prices, one for me getting permit, and one for them to get it, they always choose to save money and get the permit their self, I am listed as the EC, they are the applicant, they call for inspection, meet inspector, ect. I never see the building dept, or inspector. If I do new residential construction, then the GC does all of the above, the only time I go to the building dept is for commercial permits. I tell them for me to drive uptown, wait in line, purchase permit, schedule inspection, meet inspector...add $150...they want to do it everytime to save that.
 
scwirenut said:
i actually apply for very few permits, if I do work for a homeowner I always give them two prices, one for me getting permit, and one for them to get it, they always choose to save money and get the permit their self....
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In Mass I don't think a H.O. is required to pull a permit.

Thought I should share why,...

chapter 143 section 3L
No person shall install for hire any electrical wiring or fixtures subject to this section without first or within five days after commencing the work giving notice to the inspector of wires appointed pursuant to the provisions of section thirty-two of chapter one hundred and sixty-six
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around here, if a homeowner completes a permit for electrical work on his own dwelling, he must do the work, he cannot sub it out
 
mpd said:
around here, if a homeowner completes a permit for electrical work on his own dwelling, he must do the work, he cannot sub it out
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im not saying the homeowner is subbing out, im the EC, the permit has me listed, not the HO, they just go there, apply, and pay.

no different then if I sent my wife...., or secretary if I had one, or employee, they dont care, all they want is the fee....
 
electricmanscott said:
Another reason to avoid the headaches of permits.

Had inspection set up for 3 pm Tues afternoon. Wait...wait...wait.....4 o'clock now no inspector.

Call office and there he is. "Ran out of time, I'll be there tomorrow....."

Next one...

Buddy calls inspector (different city) Mon aft for Tues inspection. "Call back in the morning" the guy says rather than just set it up then.

He calls in the am...."I can't get out there today" the guy says

So they set it up for this morning. Buddy waits for an hour then goes into the inspectional service office which was right around the corner.

Inspector bagged in sick today. God forbid they call all the people waiting for inspections......

:rolleyes: :mad:
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careful there Scott ,..by law they have 72 hours to get there after you notify them in writing that you are ready,..... then they have 2 more days to let you know if you have passed....

CH 143 3L
Any person installing for hire electrical wiring or fixtures subject to this section shall notify the inspector of wires in writing upon the completion of the work. The inspector of wires shall, within five days of such notification, give written notice of his approval or disapproval of said work. A notice of disapproval shall contain specifications of the part of the work disapproved, together with a reference to the rule or regulation of the board of fire prevention regulations which has been violated.
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M. D. said:
careful there Scott ,..by law they have 72 hours to get there after you notify them in writing that you are ready,..... then they have 2 more days to let you know if you have passed....
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I know this but....making the apointment and NOT showing up is a different animal.
 
I'm very fortunate with most of the inspectors in my parts.

I have them in my cell phone directory, and they have me in theirs.
 
Where is charter 143 section 3L? I would like to apply it to: "unlicensed contractor by choice" those people advertise in the media in this way. Customer hire them for less money and if a permit is needed (90% of the time they work without), customer take it. The registrar of contractors are unable or don't want to do anything! Many times the inspectors go for the inspection and really help those homeowner guiding them how to correct the violation and those customer spread the news to their friends as how easy and cheap is to work in this way. Or "unlicensed" remove meter, service, install new one, clamp the new service, paint the panel to match house and BINGO! Nobody knows about the new service. I don't know if this is a different animal ... Oh, btw this is Arizona
 
Scott, I hear you.

Most of the inspectors I deal with are not very accomodating. One town I need to call between 8-8:30 a.m. to find out what time the inspection will be that day. I'm close to an hour away with morning traffic, and he might tell me 9:00. But he might also tell me 3:00. So I can't head out there early with the expectation of a morning inspection......Fortunately I've become pretty friendly with him and he will work with me. But what about everyone else?

And I know a lot of guys don't take permits out unless they absolutely have to - meaning only if there is a building permit on the job.
 
Generally, the line between "legitimate EC" and "trunkslammer" is very well defined. But when the "legitimate EC" avoids the required permits, isn't he, in fact, blurring that line considerably, and treading on the precipice of becoming a "trunkslammer"?
 
You could move to my town. Contractors have at least a 95% chance for an inspection even if we're called by 7 a.m. on any given day. Except Sat. & Sun. To my knowledge, we've never rolled an inspection more than 1 day. Plus, we have around 300 sunny days during the year, plenty of good food & grog, things to do, etc. :wink: On the other hand, if you get caught working without a permit, we can issue you a summons to appear in court. I carry a badge. :cool: :smile:
 
rcarroll said:
You could move to my town. Contractors have at least a 95% chance for an inspection even if we're called by 7 a.m. on any given day. Except Sat. & Sun. To my knowledge, we've never rolled an inspection more than 1 day. Plus, we have around 300 sunny days during the year, plenty of good food & grog, things to do, etc. :wink: On the other hand, if you get caught working without a permit, we can issue you a summons to appear in court. I carry a badge. :cool: :smile:
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How do you handle the job without a permit.

What do you do if a sub complains there is no permit?

What do you do if the job is complete for months and then they apply for a permit and you know this.
 
M. D. said:
In Mass I don't think a H.O. is required to pull a permit.

Thought I should share why,...
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why is that?they still need to get the work inspected.

Also why is it in MA, a H.O. can wire there own house but need to hire a plumber/??...
 
The first permit me or my father ever pulled was over 10 years ago when we built his house. The county that we built it has no ahj so they sub it out to another county. When the rough in was done we contacted the permitting office and the next week our rough in approval was mailed in. I was laid off at the time and on the site every day all day long he never came and inspected the rough in. When we asked for finale inspection he showed again about a week later (POCO had already turned power on and my father was already moveing in), knocked on the door asked where the main panel was and slaped a approved sticker on it and left he didn't inspect a single thing.
 
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