time in the truck

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emahler said:
lets go under the assumption that what he's doing is legal and proper...what alternatives do you suggest?

should he just let the employees decide how they individually want to be treated? or should he just give his employees the reigns to determine how his business is run?

what do you suggest?
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Somewhare floating in cyberspace is my earlier reply to this post. Is this really an either / or question?

"should he just let the employees decide how they individually want to be treated? or should he just give his employees the reigns to determine how his business is run?"
 
it is an either/or question...

i don't know where in cyberspace to find your answer..

either the boss/owner sets the procedures and runs the company, or everyone does what they want and it's anarchy...

there is no happy medium...
 
LawnGuyLandSparky said:
Cape Cod:
Harwich, MA US
to:
Milford, MA US

Total Est. Time: 1 hour, 47 minutes
Total Est. Distance: 97.18 miles

97.18 miles is exactly 47.18 miles further than what would require you pay an unemployment benefit claim for "jobsite too far."
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So they can file a claim for a week's worth of work instead of coming to work down the cape. I'll be there working. I am not sure that the state will pay them anything. But the claim will at least be in place in case the circumstances grow so that they could receive payment.
 
LawnGuyLandSparky said:
Cape Cod:
Harwich, MA US
to:
Milford, MA US

Total Est. Time: 1 hour, 47 minutes
Total Est. Distance: 97.18 miles

97.18 miles is exactly 47.18 miles further than what would require you pay an unemployment benefit claim for "jobsite too far."
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according to?
 
hardworkingstiff said:
I don't believe you were "sticking" it to anyone. It sounds to me like you were being fair and within the law.
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Thanks Lou. I have 4 guys that I am very happy with, have been with me for years, and are happy too be with me. I think I'm fair and they do too.
 
Bob Kraemer said:
I'll say this, I'm sure glad I don't work for some of you here.
In the past when I worked for someone else, here is what the rules were.

My car or van: Pay starts when I get to the job site, pay stops when I leave.

Company van, drive to job site & home from job site: Pay starts when I get to the job site, pay stops when I leave the job site.

Company van, drive to shop to pick up & return to shop: Pay starts when I get to the shop, pay stops when I return to the shop.

Anything less than the above 3 examples, you are being taken advantage of by your employer, and I don't care what state laws are regarding this.
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This is pretty much what our inside working agreement says in Miami
 
Amen brother!

Amen brother!

Bob Kraemer said:
I'll say this, I'm sure glad I don't work for some of you here.
In the past when I worked for someone else, here is what the rules were.

My car or van: Pay starts when I get to the job site, pay stops when I leave.

Company van, drive to job site & home from job site: Pay starts when I get to the job site, pay stops when I leave the job site.

Company van, drive to shop to pick up & return to shop: Pay starts when I get to the shop, pay stops when I return to the shop.

Anything less than the above 3 examples, you are being taken advantage of by your employer, and I don't care what state laws are regarding this.
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I work for a FEMA contractor who pretty much makes up his own rules and policies as it suits him, usually to get out of paying accrued leave, etc. when he fires someone or they quit. They go back and forht between letting us bring the vehicles home even when we're not on call, but the rules are pretty much the same as Bob's rules: Time starts when you get to the shop and stops when you get back to the shop. If on call, time stops when you get home, as you take the vehicle home then. If on call, time still only starts when you get to the shop. When you get a call, nights/weekends, time starts when you get the call and stops when you get home again. Not too bad most of the time. Other than that, the owner's an extremely rich a-hole. He has two businesses-his original one, which is radiological testing for industrial clients, and the FEMA maintenance work. He never even shows his face at the FEMA office trailer where we all meet to say "Thnaks for making me filthy rich!". But, at least I'm still getting paid.

Just my two cents.:D
 
So, if the employee who is driving the company vehicle back to the shop is off the clock and gets into an accident and kills someone. Who is responsible?

If the Empolyee's time ends at the job, is he allowed to indulge in a 12pk during the ride back to the shop?

On the way back to the shop, is he allowed to take a 20 mile detour to his girls house xxxxxxxxxxxx

Ask the Walmart Corporation what happens when you require an employee to work off the clock.

I know its been the norm for a long long time. Thats the way my stepdad ran his company. I'm lucky enough to work for a person now who pays both ways. He figures it in his estimates. He's making money, Im making money and the only one unhappy is the HO.
 
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emahler said:
according to?
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The department of labor. IF you move a work location to where an employee must commute more than 50 miles, they can quit and claim UE benefits. Surely you didn't think an employer could just tell an employee to meet him tomorrow at 7am 6 counties away, or in another State?
 
mrvoltamp said:
So, if the employee who is driving the company vehicle back to the shop is off the clock and gets into an accident and kills someone. Who is responsible?
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The employee, even if s/he is on the clock. Suppose the employee gets a traffic summons - would you pay it? Not that the company won't get named in a lawsuit - since the company insures the vehicle it will ultimately be responsible for the payout. But if there is a crime committed it's the employee who gets hauled off to jail. IF it's your axle that broke, that's a different story.

If the Empolyee's time ends at the job, is he allowed to indulge in a 12pk during the ride back to the shop?
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You can't control what an employee does off hours, however while in posession of your property, you can control (or at least dictate policy) on what is and is not allowable with or in a company vehicle.

On the way back to the shop, is he allowed to take a 20 mile detour to his girls house xxxxxxxxxxxx
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Our policy is, a side trip of diminuitive nature is permitted. So yes, on the way back to the shop I can run into the grocery and pick up a gallon of milk, or hit the post office. But 20 miles out of the way (in NYC) is excessive. In Kansas, it's a slight detour.

Ask the Walmart Corporation what happens when you require an employee to work off the clock.
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Pretty much nothing if you're Walmart Corporation.

I know its been the norm for a long long time. Thats the way my stepdad ran his company. I'm lucky enough to work for a person now who pays both ways. He figures it in his estimates. He's making money, Im making money and the only one unhappy is the HO.
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And they'd be unhappy no matter what the policy is.
 
LawnGuyLandSparky said:
Surely you didn't think an employer could just tell an employee to meet him tomorrow at 7am 6 counties away, or in another State?
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Yes, I have always assumed that to be so and why would it not be?

The work is where the work is, if someone does not want to work why should they get unemployment?

BTW, I am often working in another state.
 
In Washington DC the average blue collar commute is 50 plus miles one way.

I recently hired a guy that was driving more than 50 miles oneway in his personel vehicle, he was laid off. I hired him and am training him to do a more specialized work (OJT and schooling). Now he questioning me about travel time due to his long commute (after recieving a truck he bought a house further out).
 
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Most large EC's and even small ones that I know of have a mileage reimbursement of some kind.

Right now I work for a small local company and my average daily commute is 10 miles or about 15 minutes. I'm not making as much as I would working for a large company but the trade off is that I'm not spending 1.5-2 hours a day driving and I'm not filling up 2-3 times a week. Sometimes you can't put a price on "quality of life" issues like how much time you spend commuting.
 
LawnGuyLandSparky said:
The department of labor. IF you move a work location to where an employee must commute more than 50 miles, they can quit and claim UE benefits. Surely you didn't think an employer could just tell an employee to meet him tomorrow at 7am 6 counties away, or in another State?
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please cite a reference...untl then this is just an opinion....
 
this is interesting how close to the border do you live Bob..in the rural America you can travel several miles to job site..One job we had the boss rented a cabin at a resort and some RV sites..It was great as a bonus we got to take turns with our families on weekends..we had our boats (at-least I had mine) we had a couple of our personal vehicles there it was great and the cost was equal to the gas..we had one job that was 65 Miles away and we tried to car pool there..Driver got paid one way and boss even talked one of the guys to drive is car for space and gave him gas for doing it..So how would that work if you were in accident and boss was giving you gas money for driving and I believe he was paid one way..how would that work on liability..never thought about it when I was younger just did what I had to to support my family..but now I ask if the risk is worth the minimal wage I make..The wages here have been the same for several years now no big jumps and cost of living keeps going up so I actually have less..starting to think this is poverty income in our society..wonder how my kids are getting it done..we need better global markets so we can have higher unemployment rate..sorry off subject my bad..
 
LawnGuyLandSparky said:
The department of labor. IF you move a work location to where an employee must commute more than 50 miles, they can quit and claim UE benefits. Surely you didn't think an employer could just tell an employee to meet him tomorrow at 7am 6 counties away, or in another State?
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?


I'm gonna need a reference....
 
cschmid said:
this is interesting how close to the border do you live Bob....
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I live in MA no more then 4 miles to RI and I can be in CT in about 50 minutes, NH in about 60 minutes ME 90 minutes. NY in about 4 hours.

I hold licenses in MA, CT and RI, but I have also worked in NJ, PA, NY, NH, ME for my MA based employer.
 
To work in "another state" has no meaning to the discussion. Small states (in terms of geographical size) simply means you can work in more states, like iwire does.

But go west of the Mississippi, and a states' square footage goes up dramatically. To work in 'another state' can mean a 5-minute jaunt, or a 6-hour pilgrimage.
 
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