Training your apprentices

[Rockyd]

Your apprentice needs this book -

Actually he needs what's inside, in his head. He may have to much pride to say he's never bent pipe before. Or, he has painted himself into a corner he has no idea how he is going to get out of it.

First time I ever ran pipe was scary. I was fresh out of the Navy, had some time in residential, and lots of time on motors, elevators, and tons of maintenance, but no pipe time. I took a call with Brown and Root in Prudhoe Bay (oil field 1984). Got off the plane and ran into an lifelong friend of mine at the airport.

He asked if I was the new electrician?

Said Yes I am!

Asked if I knew anything about pipe?

Long look on the face told him all he needed to know.

He took me under his wing for a couple of days, and had me running excellent pipe.

Your apprentice may need some guidance, and close order supervision. it is up to you, to convey a valuable set of skills on to your cub. Hopefully you won't have to "unteach a bunch of mush" that he may have got elsewear, and turn him into an outstanding bender. He will be more than thankful if you give him the skills needed in this industry.

 

[Chenley]

That is the book I have. I mainly learned the great art of conduit bending researching online. Which you can really only find the standard 90 degree bends, kick offsets, 3 and 4-point saddles and back-to-back 90's.

This book goes all the way into concentric bends and parallel offsets. Wish I had it when I had started learning.

 

[electricalperson]

some guys just take a little longer to learn. make it clear that he can ask questions. if the helper screws up show him what he done wrong then make him fix it thats how he will learn

 

[e57]

I like to see no distinction between resi and commercial, the way I see it they are very much the same. Sure there are a few extra rules depending on material or situation. ADA, and an outlet at showroom windows. Or outlet spacing in residential. But the materials and techniques vary a little only in terms of scale. I often use pipe and MC in residential in certain situations - it gets done the same way it would in commercial. Personally - you're an Electrician - or your not. That does not mean you need to know everything, but does mean you should be well rounded in training and experiance.

Your situation sound like you have 'rope-a-dope' guys coming out of tract cookie cutter structures where they now need to start thinking about how it is different than the last one. The comfort and learning curve have crossed...

18 in years in the trade I still dont know everything - but like you am forced to teach what I do know on a daily basis to guys 4-6 years in, just as much as the guys only 2 years in. Sure - its frustrating, but it's part of the job. I'm sure you did not learn all you know in your apprenticeship? And you may have been mentored by the best - they may not have been. But now they need to know that learning does not stop with a JW card.

The bendfield book is a good start if you need pipe run, but the ability to confidently think in 3D comes with time and practice.

 

[daleuger]

18 in years in the trade I still dont know everything - but like you am forced to teach what I do know on a daily basis to guys 4-6 years in, just as much as the guys only 2 years in. Sure - its frustrating, but it's part of the job. I'm sure you did not learn all you know in your apprenticeship? And you may have been mentored by the best - they may not have been. But now they need to know that learning does not stop with a JW card.

I completely agree. I learn every day of the week. Sometimes it's older guys, sometimes I look something up I'm not totally familiar with and figure it out myself. I've learned a few things I didn't know just by reading some of the threads on this forum, whether I post in them or not. They always told us coming up that helpers don't have ideas or opinions yet, but hell every now and then even one of them comes up with a good idea how to make something easier.

 

[Pierre C Belarge]

This thread kind of makes me laugh. I think that sometimes people forget where they have been and came from.

Chill out and help the guy. If he/they do not know the answer or need help, help them. Especially if they are willing to take the help...which they will not if you are making a big deal out of nothing...


An old saying:
" the ball is round, what goes round will come back to bite you one day..."

 

[boyle78]

I became a JW about 5 months ago. I was paired up with another 4th year apprentice even before my JW because we worked very well together. We both had enough balls to make decisions on past experiences and weren't affraid to ask questions when we had no clue. In the companies I worked for in the past, I always felt like a teammate with my JW....not a burden. Even though I made mistakes like everyone else, I learned from them and tried not to make them again.
That being said, I have had the "pleasure" of trying to teach apprentices that just don't seem to care....they make a mistake, they ask my opinion, they give me the "yup-yup" and try it again....just to do it wrong again....and again...... I don't expect anything out of anyone else that I wouldn't do myself. There isn't a day that goes by that I don't learn something and that's what I like about this trade. If an apprentice doesn't want to learn then there is no use for them except to clean the van.

 

[daleuger]

Sometimes you get the JW that is a burden. One day my first year I got pulled off a job and told to take a van and go meet this guy where he was working and help him. 20 minutes in my own vehicle back to the shop (I'd been reporting to the job I was working) 30 minutes in a company van out to where he's working so that I can hop on a scissor lift and push 3 wires down a 1/2" EMT while he sat in the truck and listened to the radio. That's all he wanted. What the __________??? Oh well, it all pays the same. :grin: He was "laid off" not too long after.

 

[daleuger]

I became a JW about 5 months ago.

We turned out pretty close to the same time then. I just got mine end of August.

If an apprentice doesn't want to learn then there is no use for them except to clean the van.

I'm figuring that one out. Somebody else at work suggested he either clean the van or keep him go-fering a lot. Name off a couple of things I need then when they do get back suddenly "remember" a couple more whether you're gonna need them or not. Not a good way to utilize the labour, but it's better than wasting his wages and mine if he just doesn't want to learn IMO.