ungrounded receptacles

[bob j]

Just looking for some other input on this situation- a customer failed a recent home inspection.She was cited for having ungrounded 3 prong receptacles serving her kitchen countertop. All of the rest of the receps in her home were the old two prong variety. All of the outlet boxes in the house are plastic and all of the wiring feeding them appears to be old cloth insulated type(no ground).In trying to fix the situation in the most unintrusive,cost-effective way, I suggested replacing the three prong receps with gfcis.The inspector will not accept this solution.He says if I install the gfcis, they still must be grounded.I have to do that or replace the three prong receps with the original two prong style(which should be gfcis anyway, since they are serving a kitchen countertop.)Any advice or suggestions?

 

[480sparky]

Ask for a code reference.

Is the 'inspector' a home inspector, or an AHJ?

 

[raider1]

Show the inspector 406.3(D)(3)(b).

Chris

 

[Dennis Alwon]

All of the outlet boxes in the house are plastic and all of the wiring feeding them appears to be old cloth insulated type(no ground).

I find this very interesting. Someone thought it was a good idea to change all the old metal boxes to plastic but leave the 2 wire feed?? I don't believe we had plastic boxes until nm cable had 3 wires.

 

[360Youth]

I find this very interesting. Someone thought it was a good idea to change all the old metal boxes to plastic but leave the 2 wire feed?? I don't believe we had plastic boxes until nm cable had 3 wires.

It is a lot easier to replace a box than internal wiring. Now if the walls were opened up at one point, than I would have to agree with you.

 

[Chamuit]

Show the inspector 406.3(D)(3)(b).

Chris

Chris is right.

I find this very interesting. Someone thought it was a good idea to change all the old metal boxes to plastic but leave the 2 wire feed?? I don't believe we had plastic boxes until nm cable had 3 wires.

We see the two-wire NM in phenolic boxes, occasionally.

 

[peter d]

We see the two-wire NM in phenolic boxes, occasionally.

I think the brown phenolic Union brand boxes are the oldest NM boxes still being made.

They first made their appearance here in buildings from the early 1970's. EC's from that time period and before seemed to choose the smallest they make, and in the case of the Union box is was the 16 cubic inch "2000" style. Those are always fun to put a dimmer or GFCI in, particularly with 2 12/2 NM cables. :roll:

Before they Union boxes became popular, sectional metal boxes were common in residential work, and again the smallest size (2.5" deep) seemed to be the first choice.

 

[bob j]

Subsidized housing

Subsidized housing

Ask for a code reference.

Is the 'inspector' a home inspector, or an AHJ?

The inspector is not the local AHJ.The homeowner appears to have some sort of government subsidized living arrangement, and this inspection is part of that arrangement.What's ironic about the whole situation is that this person has been living in this home for 15 years, with annual inspections the whole time,and this is the only time anything has ever been cited.Someone dusted off their receptacle tester and found out what has probably been there since the 50's.

 

[JohnJ0906]

The inspector is not the local AHJ.The homeowner appears to have some sort of government subsidized living arrangement, and this inspection is part of that arrangement.

This inspector is from some government agency? If so, he may just be an AHJ for this.