What a bad generator install looks like

[Joethemechanic]

Customer said he’d either give it away to a family member or sell it.


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I was thinking you'd end up with it. Ones that are in good shape with low hours can bring good money

 

[Joethemechanic]

Just curious, why is he switching to propane from natural gas? Not enough NG to supply a 50KW?

 

[hillbilly1]

I don’t think he is switching, just getting more capacity. Natural gas is nowhere near as common in the south as it is in the north. Nearest natural gas line to my house is close to 40 miles away. When installing larger generators in Atlanta, sometimes they would have to upgrade to a larger line and meter from the street.

 

[Joethemechanic]

I don’t think he is switching, just getting more capacity. Natural gas is nowhere near as common in the south as it is in the north. Nearest natural gas line to my house is close to 40 miles away. When installing larger generators in Atlanta, sometimes they would have to upgrade to a larger line and meter from the street.

I was just going by the pictures. That looks like NG line and regulator. My preference is actually propane and I have gas running down my side of the street. If something bad happens, is the NG even going to work?

 

[gadfly56]

I don’t think he is switching, just getting more capacity. Natural gas is nowhere near as common in the south as it is in the north. Nearest natural gas line to my house is close to 40 miles away. When installing larger generators in Atlanta, sometimes they would have to upgrade to a larger line and meter from the street.

This can really bite you in the nether regions. You have to make sure that you don't starve the generator when it fires up. I think one time I was looking at a generator for my house, and it was just 7kW, but I had to bump up one size on the gas line. No thanks.

 

[gadfly56]

I was just going by the pictures. That looks like NG line and regulator. My preference is actually propane and I have gas running down my side of the street. If something bad happens, is the NG even going to work?

Depends on the kind of "bad" you get. Snowmageddon, probably OK; alien bombardment from outer space, probably not.

 

[hillbilly1]

I was just going by the pictures. That looks like NG line and regulator. My preference is actually propane and I have gas running down my side of the street. If something bad happens, is the NG even going to work?

Probably second stage regulator, very common if the tank is not real close. I have one that’s dual fuel, normally runs on Natural gas, but if it’s interrupted, it automatically switches over to propane. Pulled it out of a store in Atlanta. Don’t see that often here, but pretty common on stores that are in earthquake prone zones.

 

[hillbilly1]

This can really bite you in the nether regions. You have to make sure that you don't starve the generator when it fires up. I think one time I was looking at a generator for my house, and it was just 7kW, but I had to bump up one size on the gas line. No thanks.

I went out on a call on a new orange box store, the generator people were saying that something electrical was shutting the generator down after it transferred. Slowly brought the load on line breaker by breaker, with about 10% of the load on, the generator shut down. Went out to the generator, saw the 3/4” gas line ran to the 60 kw generator………

 

[Buck Parrish]

Ditto.

And is that EMT in the PVC fittings?

I've not heard any one say 'Dittos' since my hero passed away.

 

[ptonsparky]

Probably second stage regulator, very common if the tank is not real close. I have one that’s dual fuel, normally runs on Natural gas, but if it’s interrupted, it automatically switches over to propane. Pulled it out of a store in Atlanta. Don’t see that often here, but pretty common on stores that are in earthquake prone zones.

I believe we are required to have a second stage regulator. At least the last ones we did.

 

[brantmacga]

Just curious, why is he switching to propane from natural gas? Not enough NG to supply a 50KW?

It’s propane, and yes that’s the 2nd stage regulator. We have natural gas in most towns/cities here, but not in rural areas. This house sits in the middle of a several thousand acre tract.


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[brantmacga]

I went out on a call on a new orange box store, the generator people were saying that something electrical was shutting the generator down after it transferred. Slowly brought the load on line breaker by breaker, with about 10% of the load on, the generator shut down. Went out to the generator, saw the 3/4” gas line ran to the 60 kw generator………

I’m pretty certain that’s about to happen here as well. I met the gas man on site yesterday to discuss the 1.5” line the specs require as we are 100’ from the tank; he’s arguing the 3/4” line is acceptable. I had this same issue on the last 48kw I installed. I told them it was wrong, and they still argued with me when the unit shut down from fuel starvation and said something was wrong with the generator. They are working for the customer, not me, but I forwarded my concerns to the customer.


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[Birken Vogt]

I sold him a 60kw, ordered in June 2022, it came in Monday this week.

Could have had a Kohler in less than half that time, maybe much less. Is this the 60 kw, 3600 RPM, with the tiny 4 cylinder engine?

 

[brantmacga]

Could have had a Kohler in less than half that time, maybe much less. Is this the 60 kw, 3600 RPM, with the tiny 4 cylinder engine?

1800 rpm 4.5L

I don’t sell the 3600 rpm units. The cost difference between comparable models is only about $1500.


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[Joethemechanic]

1800 rpm 4.5L

I don’t sell the 3600 rpm units. The cost difference between comparable models is only about $1500.


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I don't like the 3600 RPM units at all. They are smaller and lighter so I can see some places where they would be a good fit, but not my first choice

 

[hillbilly1]

1800 rpm 4.5L

I don’t sell the 3600 rpm units. The cost difference between comparable models is only about $1500.


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They are much quieter too. Only drawback is real heavy motor loads tend to fluctuate the voltage more, but properly sized, that is usually not a big issue.

 

[GoldDigger]

This can really bite you in the nether regions. You have to make sure that you don't starve the generator when it fires up. I think one time I was looking at a generator for my house, and it was just 7kW, but I had to bump up one size on the gas line. No thanks.

With existing propane distant from the house and generator, you can sometimes avoid having to upsize the main line from the tank to the house by switching to a dual stage regulator system.
The main line will then carry propane at several psi, increasing the flow capacity of that line, with secondary regulators at the generator and the house dropping the pressure to the proper operating pressure for appliance without their own regulator.
If installing a propane source from scratch, you may design the system to carry full tank pressure all the way to the generator.

 

[Joethemechanic]

You are running 60 KW on propane that is being vaporized in the storage tank? I would have thought something that large would draw enough to need a vaporizer. I guess if the tank is really large

 

[brantmacga]

You are running 60 KW on propane that is being vaporized in the storage tank? I would have thought something that large would draw enough to need a vaporizer. I guess if the tank is really large

The specs on this unit call for no more than 80% fill on the tank, and it can’t draw vapor at less than 20%. They currently have a 250/gal tank for the 22kw unit but will install a larger tank next week when I set the new unit. Idk what size they’re going with, that’s between the customer and gas company. The 250/gal tank can only supply about 30/hrs of runtime under average load.

 

[Joethemechanic]

They make electric vaporizers if you ever have the need for one. If you use an engine coolant heated one on a back up generator is they will freeze up if you don't have a block heater. They start and go up to speed before the coolant is warm and freeze up. Maybe not a real problem down south, but up here it's a royal PIA.



This is one, but there many

ZIMMER™ Electric LPG Vaporizer - Algas-SDI

The Algas-SDI ZIMMER™ Electric LPG Vaporizer's patented design incorporates breakthrough technology never before seen in the LP-Gas industry.

algas-sdi.com