What size plug and receptacle?

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iwire

iwire

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I have to wire a bunch of self contained coolers, here is the labeling.

WFMMiniBunkerlarge.jpg


Questions.

1) Can this unit be cord and plug connected at all? (Upper left "Permanently connected")

2) If so can I use a 20 amp circuit, plug and receptacle? (18.6 MCA)
 
Not sure about cord and plug be permitted but if I were using one I would use a 30 amp cord and receptacle with a 25 amp OCPD.
 
If the unit states permanently connected why are you asking if cord and plug can be used? Not sure what I am missing.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
If the unit states permanently connected why are you asking if cord and plug can be used? Not sure what I am missing.
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The unit is on wheels, it shipped with a six foot cord on it and an L5-30P on the end of the cord but the cord is European and the plug is American a Pass & Seymour.

My hunch is the that the unit is foreign made and when it arrived here the US vender put the Pass & Seymour plug on it.

Now the vender is telling the customer all I have to do is provide an 'adapter cord' with a male 5-20P on one end and a female L5-30C on the other end so that the unit can plug into a standard outlet.

Keep in mind I have about 20 of these to do so I am trying to get it straight first.
 
infinity said:
if I were using one I would use a 30 amp cord and receptacle with a 25 amp OCPD.
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That would be ideal for me, not the customer as they were told that they could wheel them around and plug them into any standard outlet.

Now of course I could tell the customer that they are screwed but I would rather try to find a solution that is good for both the customer any myself.:)
 
With an MCA of 18.6 this unit will run all day on a 20 amp circuit. I don't see how you could use a 20 amp plug/receptacle if the OCPD is 25 amps.
 
infinity said:
With an MCA of 18.6 this unit will run all day on a 20 amp circuit. I don't see how you could use a 20 amp plug/receptacle if the OCPD is 25 amps.
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Put each on a individual 20A branch circuit. Nothing says the OCPD has to be 25, only that 25 is the maximum. Try one unit on a 20A c/b to make sure it doesn't trip.
 
infinity said:
With an MCA of 18.6 this unit will run all day on a 20 amp circuit. I don't see how you could use a 20 amp plug/receptacle if the OCPD is 25 amps.
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I agree - it seems 210.21(B)(3) would prohibit that but that does not mean it cannot be used with a 20 amp circuit. The 25 amps is the max OP. You certainly can't just wheel it around and plug it anywhere esp. if there are other items on those circuits. I believe I would let them know the harsh reality and permanently wire them.
 
What about the permanently wired statement? I see no issue with cord and plug but they will not be portable unless there are separate circuits for them.
 
david luchini said:
Put each on a individual 20A branch circuit. Nothing says the OCPD has to be 25, only that 25 is the maximum. Try one unit on a 20A c/b to make sure it doesn't trip.
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I agree, and that is what I have done with one.

But the customer is questioning the illegality of me changing the plug from a 30 to a 20 and once I really look at the labeling I am not sure I can use a plug at all.
 
jumper said:
Bit OT here: but this one reason why I am glad somebody else tells me what to do for a living. Just give me a nice set of prints with the specs and I am content. I could not be a EC or PM.
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LOL>

Yeah I hear ya.

My position is service director and often that requires planing and designing jobs myself. (Or with help from all of you guys on the forums:cool:)
 
The vendor is wrong. 210.23(A)(1) and 210.23 dictate that if they want to roll it around and plug it in anywhere, it should have an MCA of 16A or less. If you install dedicated circuits around the place, keep the odd plug, and supply them with 30A receptacles and 25A circuits that would be okay.
 
George Stolz said:
The vendor is wrong. 210.23(A)(1) and 210.23 dictate that if they want to roll it around and plug it in anywhere, it should have an MCA of 16A or less.
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That depends on what the "anywhere" consists of. If the "anywhere" is a bunch of 20A individual branch circuits, then that would be OK. They wouldn't be able to plug into multi-receptacle branch circuits.

George Stolz said:
If you install dedicated circuits around the place, keep the odd plug, and supply them with 30A receptacles and 25A circuits that would be okay.
Click to expand...

The dedicated circuits could be 20A for these units, per 210.23.
 
I don't have time at the moment to deal with the other issue, but here is my take on one tricky issue:
iwire said:
1) Can this unit be cord and plug connected at all? (Upper left "Permanently connected")
Click to expand...
I submit that you can ignore the "permanently connected" phrase on the label. It is not an electrical statement (i.e., the electrical information appears below, under its own heading.) It refers to the nature of the appliance, stating that it is capable of being used in that way, and not stating that it is required to be used in that way.

Without reading anyone else's comments on the other question, I will just say that my initial reaction was to say a 20 amp cord and a 20 amp breaker would be acceptable. The 20 amp cord exceeds the requirements of the Minimum Circuit Ampacity (MCA). The 20 amp breaker is within the restriction of having a Maximum Overcurrent Protection (MOP) of 25 amps.
 
My thoughts go along with charlie b's Post #19 except it seems that it would still be a violation of 210.23(A)(1)
 
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