What's wrong with this picture

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StanleyBeau

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This house just passed the electrical rough about a couple of weeks ago. I know that they are under the 2013 NEC. Notice that there are walls (marked by X) wider than 24" that do not have receptacles in them. Am I missing something? How are they allowed not to have receptacles in these walls? Any thoughts?
 

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IMO, those walls are not required to have an outlet as long as the others are within 12' Since the wall is continuous you don't look at those sections as separate walls but part of the zigzag of the wall itself.
 
StanleyBeau said:
This house just passed the electrical rough about a couple of weeks ago. I know that they are under the 2013 NEC. Notice that there are walls (marked by X) wider than 24" that do not have receptacles in them. Am I missing something? How are they allowed not to have receptacles in these walls? Any thoughts?
Click to expand...

So... the code is "Seperate wall spaces" greater than 24".

Then is the basic 6 foot rule. " spacing. Receptacles shall be installed such that no
point measured horizontally along the floor line of anywall space is more than 1.8 m (6 ft) from a receptacle​
outlet
Also there is not 2013 code.
We cannot tell if the dorm area is greater than 12' it could be!
 
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Sorry I meant 2014.
Also based on 210.52(A)(2)(1) Any wall space 24 in. (600 mm) or more in width in kitchens, family rooms, dining rooms, living rooms, parlors, libraries, dens, sunrooms, bedrooms, recreation rooms, or similar room or area of dwelling units must have a receptacle outlet.
I don't see where it specifies "Seperate".
I know of someone who got flagged last month for not putting a receptacle outlet in a 25" wall 90ing a wall that had a receptacle outlet in it about 4' away. The 25" wall was the side of the entry door to the room. If the receptacle outlet spacing is strictly so no distance is greater than 6' to an outlet then how come this 25" wall that's 4' away from an outlet is required to have a receptacle?

Sierrasparky said:
So... the code is "Seperate wall spaces" greater than 24".

Then is the basic 6 foot rule. " spacing. Receptacles shall be installed such that no
point measured horizontally along the floor line of anywall space is more than 1.8 m (6 ft) from a receptacle​
outlet
Also there is not 2013 code.
We cannot tell if the dorm area is greater than 12' it could be!
Click to expand...
 
StanleyBeau said:
Sorry I meant 2014.
Also based on 210.52(A)(2)(1) Any wall space 24 in. (600 mm) or more in width in kitchens, family rooms, dining rooms, living rooms, parlors, libraries, dens, sunrooms, bedrooms, recreation rooms, or similar room or area of dwelling units must have a receptacle outlet.
I don't see where it specifies "Seperate".
I know of someone who got flagged last month for not putting a receptacle outlet in a 25" wall 90ing a wall that had a receptacle outlet in it about 4' away. The 25" wall was the side of the entry door to the room. If the receptacle outlet spacing is strictly so no distance is greater than 6' to an outlet then how come this 25" wall that's 4' away from an outlet is required to have a receptacle?
Click to expand...


So in your opinion that one zigzag wall is really 3 walls-- sorry I don't think that is correct- it is one wall that is not straight. Suppose the wall was a curve? How would you determine that?

Look at 210.52 (A)(2)(1) it says including sections measured around corners and unbroken along the floor line. I think that wall fits that descritption
 
I agree too, start on one end and measure 6' and then every 12' in between. Anyone saying that each wall section 24" or greater needs a receptacle is incorrect.
 
This picture is of the job last month that was flagged for not having a receptacle in the 25" wall on the right of the photo. This photo was taken after the addition of the new receptacle. Why would this count as a wall? Why can't it be considered as a zigzag as you previously said?
The inspector didn't care that there's a receptacle 4' away. He kept saying it's a wall more than 24".
He passed the job only after the addition of the receptacle.
Thanks Dennis

Dennis Alwon said:
So in your opinion that one zigzag wall is really 3 walls-- sorry I don't think that is correct- it is one wall that is not straight. Suppose the wall was a curve? How would you determine that?

Look at 210.52 (A)(2)(1) it says including sections measured around corners and unbroken along the floor line. I think that wall fits that descritption
Click to expand...
 

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You cannot count it as one wall space or within 6' of a receptacle if you have to cross a doorway or other opening for traffic. An underlying principle is that you would not want to run a cord across the doorway or whatever at floor level.
Have you looked at the Handbook for this section? It may not be enforceable but it can be educational.
What the other section's intent is, IMHO, is to tell you that for an isolated wall segment smaller than 24" you do not need to install a receptacle even if it is more than 6' from the nearest receptacle.
And, as mentioned earlier, the distance along the wall line can go around corners. It just cannot cross doors. (Windows are OK.)
Based on your photo, the inspector is flat out wrong!
 
StanleyBeau said:
This picture is of the job last month that was flagged for not having a receptacle in the 25" wall on the right of the photo. This photo was taken after the addition of the new receptacle. Why would this count as a wall? Why can't it be considered as a zigzag as you previously said?
The inspector didn't care that there's a receptacle 4' away. He kept saying it's a wall more than 24".
He passed the job only after the addition of the receptacle.
Thanks Dennis
Click to expand...


He's wrong. I would wonder how such a simple code section could be misinterpreted. This one has been around for decades.
 
So It's justifiable to yell at the guy and call his supervisor. The only thing is that it didn't help so we submitted to the tyrant. I've never met an electrical inspector who wasn't so darn arrogant and stubborn. They sure may well be out there but I haven't had the fortune to meet one of those...

infinity said:
He's wrong. I would wonder how such a simple code section could be misinterpreted. This one has been around for decades.
Click to expand...
 
StanleyBeau said:
Sorry I meant 2014.
Also based on 210.52(A)(2)(1) Any wall space 24 in. (600 mm) or more in width in kitchens, family rooms, dining rooms, living rooms, parlors, libraries, dens, sunrooms, bedrooms, recreation rooms, or similar room or area of dwelling units must have a receptacle outlet.
I don't see where it specifies "Seperate".
I know of someone who got flagged last month for not putting a receptacle outlet in a 25" wall 90ing a wall that had a receptacle outlet in it about 4' away. The 25" wall was the side of the entry door to the room. If the receptacle outlet spacing is strictly so no distance is greater than 6' to an outlet then how come this 25" wall that's 4' away from an outlet is required to have a receptacle?
Click to expand...

From your description it does not need a receptacle. At the doorway you put the first outlet no more than 6 feet. then the next 12 feet. This way there is no space greater than 6' reach. It does not matter how many zigs or zags the wall makes. If you folks are getting busted then you need to school the inspector.
 
StanleyBeau said:
So It's justifiable to yell at the guy and call his supervisor. The only thing is that it didn't help so we submitted to the tyrant. I've never met an electrical inspector who wasn't so darn arrogant and stubborn. They sure may well be out there but I haven't had the fortune to meet one of those...
Click to expand...

Since he's clearly wrong you plead your case and if he still doesn't listen then you go over his head. I would question someone competency if they really called this a violation. I would also wonder if they ever really worked as an electrician and actually wired a dwelling where they did device layout.
 
StanleyBeau said:
This picture is of the job last month that was flagged for not having a receptacle in the 25" wall on the right of the photo. This photo was taken after the addition of the new receptacle. Why would this count as a wall? Why can't it be considered as a zigzag as you previously said?
The inspector didn't care that there's a receptacle 4' away. He kept saying it's a wall more than 24".
He passed the job only after the addition of the receptacle.
Thanks Dennis
Click to expand...

It looks to me like the receptacle is more than 6 feet from the edge of the door if you count the stud bays. That is probably what the problem was.
 
I agree with the others here. When you measure it's 12 linear feet between receptacles. As an example, after you place the first receptacle you measure 5' to the corner and then 7' to the next receptacle. If you have a break in the room (like a doorway or a closet) if there is 2' of wall space and you haven't fulfilled the minimum requirement for receptacles in that room then you'll have to install one there. In your case you don't have a break in wall space, just a zig-zag. So, you'll have to take that into consideration in your receptacle placemant and measure around each corner.
 
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