When should you ask utility if there is enough power available?

Status
Not open for further replies.

Tainted

Senior Member
Location
New York
Occupation
Engineer (PE)
I am making plans to utilize power from an existing switchboard. The load I would need is 15KVA.
When should you ask the utility if there is enough power available and if existing service is adequate for the load? Is it even required for low loads such as mine?
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
You shouldn’t. You should do a load calculation and figure it out yourself
Think he is asking for an existing service, when should you inform POCO that you are adding significant amount of load that they may want to consider whether or not they need to increase transformer size. Just because you might have plenty of service conductor doesn't mean they have a transformer that can actually supply that much for extended periods of time. They tend to size transformers for actual demand conditions.
 

Tainted

Senior Member
Location
New York
Occupation
Engineer (PE)
No you do a load calculation lol. That’s why we charge by the hour right ?? Or you could put a logging meter on it for a month or two
No engineer I know has ever done a calculation to check if load is adequate, they just simply did estimations
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
I am making plans to utilize power from an existing switchboard. The load I would need is 15KVA.
When should you ask the utility if there is enough power available and if existing service is adequate for the load? Is it even required for low loads such as mine?
It depends on many factors. First you need to know what the demand history looks like and then figure what the future demand will look like.

If you are adding a significant load but it has somewhat limited demand, they might be fine with leaving things as is.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
No engineer I know has ever done a calculation to check if load is adequate, they just simply did estimations
A lot of the time you don't even need to calculate existing, contact the POCO and get demand history from them. May need to get the customer to authorize this before they will give it to you.
 

Tainted

Senior Member
Location
New York
Occupation
Engineer (PE)
It depends on many factors. First you need to know what the demand history looks like and then figure what the future demand will look like.

If you are adding a significant load but it has somewhat limited demand, they might be fine with leaving things as is.
If I’m adding like 200kw, of course I would ask utilities if service is adequate, but if it’s 15kw, I’m not quite sure. I just don’t know where the line crosses
 

augie47

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Tennessee
Occupation
State Electrical Inspector (Retired)
Generally, our POCOs don't show concern unless there is significant enough increase to warrant a service upgrade.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
If I’m adding like 200kw, of course I would ask utilities if service is adequate, but if it’s 15kw, I’m not quite sure. I just don’t know where the line crosses
If adding 15 kW to a dwelling service chances are you contact POCO. If you adding 15 kW to something already served by a 1.5mVA transformer, you may not even be close to needing to contact them about it.
 

EC Dan

Senior Member
Location
Florida
Occupation
E&C Manager
A lot of the time you don't even need to calculate existing, contact the POCO and get demand history from them. May need to get the customer to authorize this before they will give it to you.

Will the POCO even have information on peak demand by customer?
 

Terminator5047

Senior Member
Location
Saint Louis
Occupation
Electrician
Think he is asking for an existing service, when should you inform POCO that you are adding significant amount of load that they may want to consider whether or not they need to increase transformer size. Just because you might have plenty of service conductor doesn't mean they have a transformer that can actually supply that much for extended periods of time. They tend to size transformers for actual demand conditions.
Very clearly that’s not what he asked. And either way still need to do a load calculation to tell the poco the intended load. And if they didn’t install a transformer for the current capacity that’s on them
 

Tainted

Senior Member
Location
New York
Occupation
Engineer (PE)
If adding 15 kW to a dwelling service chances are you contact POCO. If you adding 15 kW to something already served by a 1.5mVA transformer, you may not even be close to needing to contact them about it.
What if it’s a residential apartment building?
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
Generally, our POCOs don't show concern unless there is significant enough increase to warrant a service upgrade.
I've had many situations where service was fairly oversized for the initial load, but when adding some significant load the POCO needed to increase transformer size, but the service was able to handle the additional load.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
Very clearly that’s not what he asked. And either way still need to do a load calculation to tell the poco the intended load. And if they didn’t install a transformer for the current capacity that’s on them
POCO's seldom install a transformer for current capacity unless maybe a larger commercial/industrial facility that is loaded to that capacity.

How many single family dwellings out there with 200 amp services and only on a 25kVA transformer? Even multiple homes on said 25 kVA?

25 kVA is only 104 amps.

Reality is the typical demand on those is low enough they can get by with the 25. They may go over that at times but usually not for long enough to be a problem. If load increases enough they will increase the transformer size.
 

winnie

Senior Member
Location
Springfield, MA, USA
Occupation
Electric motor research
If I do an installation, I am obliged to do a load calc to determine if the service equipment is not overloaded.

But if I determine that the service equipment is correctly sized per article 220, at what point do I need to say anything to the POCO? Remember that the POCO has their own rules, and their installation is often undersized compared to the service equipment.

-Jon
 

petersonra

Senior Member
Location
Northern illinois
Occupation
engineer
I am making plans to utilize power from an existing switchboard. The load I would need is 15KVA.
When should you ask the utility if there is enough power available and if existing service is adequate for the load? Is it even required for low loads such as mine?
15 kVA is only 18 A at 480 V 3 phase. I would not worry all that much about adding such a minor load.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top