2023 kitchen receptacle requirements

[JoeStillman]

Our designs deal with islands and peninsulas (peninsulae?) a lot. Often it's got no studs and drywall anywhere on the structure. When it's just cabinetry like that with a single-level counter, it's very hard to find a safe place to mount an outlet. It's a simple thing when there's a backsplash and a second barstool-height counter above the work surface.

I predict that the requirement to put outlets in islands will come back later after enough people get hurt tripping over the extension cords stretched out from the wall to the island. I think the code should remain fundamentally anti-extension cord.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

The entire premise of this is odd. Allowing the home owner and/or designer to choose is not an NEC protocol. These people will not be the only ones owning the home so what happens when new owners take over. I get the concept of leaving a circuit there for future use but if the designer has this freedom then the actual design of the cabinet could be built where it would not be possible to install an outlet at a reasonable location or compliant location for that matter.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

The entire premise of this is odd. Allowing the home owner and/or designer to choose is not an NEC protocol. These people will not be the only ones owning the home so what happens when new owners take over. I get the concept of leaving a circuit there for future use but if the designer has this freedom then the actual design of the cabinet could be built where it would not be possible to install an outlet at a reasonable location or compliant location for that matter.

As far as the words I have put into bold, I refer you to 90.1.

(A) Practical Safeguarding.
The purpose of this Code is the practical safeguarding of persons and property from hazards arising from the use of electricity. This Code is not intended as a design specification or an instruction manual for untrained persons.

This is really driven by the large number of objections to receptacles in or on the counter and the very real safety issue of prohibiting any receptacles below the countertop. It appears that the concern for the safety hazard of the hanging cords was a larger concern to the CMP than the convenience of a required receptacle.

I expect that this will result in a NITMAN and will be debated on the floor of the 2022 NFPA annual meeting. Any person who has been a member of the NFPA for at least 6 months prior to the vote and who attends the meeting in person can vote on the motions. There are not a lot of people who do attend and vote....I think for the 2020 cycle there were about 400 votes cast on the motion that had the most votes.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

As far as the words I have put into bold, I refer you to 90.1.

Don, you know as well as I do that the code is a design manual. How can it not be when we are told where almost every outlet should be placed. When we are told that a switch is required in every room for some sort of lighting. Much of the code is designed and I have no problem with that.

 

[jim dungar]

Don, you know as well as I do that the code is a design manual. How can it not be when we are told where almost every outlet should be placed. When we are told that a switch is required in every room for some sort of lighting. Much of the code is designed and I have no problem with that.

IMO, a true design manual should be able to stand on its own.
While the NEC does contain design requirements, it alone is not sufficient to design or install a 'proper' electrical installation, especially for untrained persons.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Don, you know as well as I do that the code is a design manual. How can it not be when we are told where almost every outlet should be placed. When we are told that a switch is required in every room for some sort of lighting. Much of the code is designed and I have no problem with that.

I guess my point is that the code should not be telling us those things. The code should only be telling us how to install and wire those things where they are required by the design or other codes.

 

[steve66]

As far as installing a receptacle "in" the countertop, I thought Kitchen receptacles were prohibited from being installed face up because spills will flow down into the receptacle?

The prohibition of outlets below or not more than 20" above the countertop is also unfortunate. We frequently see split level islands with a larger countertop at a lower level, and a smaller bar height counter slightly higher. Between the two levels is a perfect place to install outlets - above the big counter and below the smaller "bar" counter. They can be used for appliances on either countertop, and they are protected from small children pulling the cords (and pulling down cooking appliances) because they are above the lower countertop.

Now those outlets will be prohibited because they are below the upper counter.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

As far as installing a receptacle "in" the countertop, I thought Kitchen receptacles were prohibited from being installed face up because spills will flow down into the receptacle?

The prohibition of outlets below or not more than 20" above the countertop is also unfortunate. We frequently see split level islands with a larger countertop at a lower level, and a smaller bar height counter slightly higher. Between the two levels is a perfect place to install outlets - above the big counter and below the smaller "bar" counter. They can be used for appliances on either countertop, and they are protected from small children pulling the cords (and pulling down cooking appliances) because they are above the lower countertop.

Now those outlets will be prohibited because they are below the upper counter.

We were not talking about receptacles in the countertop but rather on the side of the cabinet. We are talking islands and peninsulas.

It has been not more than 12" down and not more than a 6" overhang for a long time. Those in the counter are the pop up style so they are not facing up.

 

[infinity]

Don, you know as well as I do that the code is a design manual. How can it not be when we are told where almost every outlet should be placed. When we are told that a switch is required in every room for some sort of lighting. Much of the code is designed and I have no problem with that.

I agree, the consensus is that the NEC is just that a design manual. It shouldn't be but in reality it is.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

We were not talking about receptacles in the countertop but rather on the side of the cabinet. We are talking islands and peninsulas.

It has been not more than 12" down and not more than a 6" overhang for a long time. Those in the counter are the pop up style so they are not facing up.

The receptacles not being face up in the counter top was replaced by 406.5(E) and (F) requiring that the assembly be specifically listed for use in countertops or work surfaces. At this time there is only one product that is specifically listed for use in countertops. I don't believe that the one in this picture is the brand that is actually listed for use in countertops.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

The receptacles not being face up in the counter top was replaced by 406.5(E) and (F) requiring that the assembly be specifically listed for use in countertops or work surfaces. At this time there is only one product that is specifically listed for use in countertops. I don't believe that the one in this picture is the brand that is actually listed for use in countertops.

I was just giving Steve an idea of what we were not talking about.

This is water tite etc but not specifically listed for kitchens AFAIK

 

[Dennis Alwon]

The receptacles not being face up in the counter top was replaced by 406.5(E) and (F) requiring that the assembly be specifically listed for use in countertops or work surfaces. At this time there is only one product that is specifically listed for use in countertops. I don't believe that the one in this picture is the brand that is actually listed for use in countertops.

Have they decided whether a pop receptacle has to be direct wired. That is something that comes up now and then. Also that section you stated doesn't say they must be listed for kitchens which I was surprised. Work surface can be with or without water so IMO a water seal should be required,

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Have they decided whether a pop receptacle has to be direct wired. That is something that comes up now and then. Also that section you stated doesn't say they must be listed for kitchens which I was surprised. Work surface can be with or without water so IMO a water seal should be required,

Cord and plug connected pop-up are listed at relocatable power taps and not suitable for installation in permanently installed countertops or work surfaces.

A pop up listed for a work surface includes a spill test but only 8 ounces of liquid are used. The product listed for a countertop must pass 64 ounce spill test.

The requirement is based on where the pop up is installed...in a countertop or a work surface, but they have not defined what those two things are. I understand that those two terms will be defined in the 2023 code.

 

[GoldDigger]

Last time I looked (admittedly not recently) that popup receptacle unit was not actually available for sale.

Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk

 

[wwhitney]

Last time I looked (admittedly not recently) that popup receptacle unit was not actually available for sale.

Looks available now, e.g.

https://www.amazon.com/Bryant-Electric-RCT200W-Countertop-Receptacle/dp/B07FKK1SMT

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Hv&Lv]

Last time I looked (admittedly not recently) that popup receptacle unit was not actually available for sale.

Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk

https://www.socalelectric.com/products/spill-proof-kitchen-counter-pop-up-with-20a-tr-self-testing-gfi-receptacle-stainless?variant=39337692102721&currency=USD&utm_medium=product_sync&utm_source=google&utm_content=sag_organic&utm_campaign=sag_organic&utm_campaign=gs-2020-06-22&utm_source=google&utm_medium=smart_campaign&gclid=CjwKCAjwq9mLBhB2EiwAuYdMtaMNoYIoirQEHhlaY9kcT5p8wXwwRiIeiM1ttEvNKlzc6Urh-eGYzhoC1mEQAvD_BwE

How deep is your pockets..

 

[don_resqcapt19]

The only one on the market at this time that is actually listed for use in a countertop is the one made by Hubbell.

 

[steve66]

We were not talking about receptacles in the countertop but rather on the side of the cabinet. We are talking islands and peninsulas.

It has been not more than 12" down and not more than a 6" overhang for a long time. Those in the counter are the pop up style so they are not facing up.

I didn't think about the pop up types. I wasn't sure what they were thinking when they said "in the countertop".

 

[Hv&Lv]

The only one on the market at this time that is actually listed for use in a countertop is the one made by Hubbell.

Maybe I‘m reading the website wrong for the one I posted in #36?
From the site:

• Color: Stainless steel metal top
• Black outlet: 20 Amp GFCI
• Tamper resistant (TR) plugs
• Weather resistant (WR) outlet
• ETL listed for USA installations, # 4004534
• cETL listed for Canada installation, # 4004534
• CSA approved for Canada, #C22.2
• Conforms to UL 514A and 498
• UL listed receptacle, # E229322
• Water protection: IP 54 Spill proof rated

 

[GeorgeB]

https://www.socalelectric.com/products/spill-proof-kitchen-counter-pop-up-with-20a-tr-self-testing-gfi-receptacle-stainless?variant=39337692102721&currency=USD&utm_medium=product_sync&utm_source=google&utm_content=sag_organic&utm_campaign=sag_organic&utm_campaign=gs-2020-06-22&utm_source=google&utm_medium=smart_campaign&gclid=CjwKCAjwq9mLBhB2EiwAuYdMtaMNoYIoirQEHhlaY9kcT5p8wXwwRiIeiM1ttEvNKlzc6Urh-eGYzhoC1mEQAvD_BwE

How deep is your pockets..

That one is cord-and-plug connected. Permanent wiring?