business area

Learn the NEC with Mike Holt now!

business area

  • Yes, i want it now!

    Votes: 15 23.4%

  • a good idea

    Votes: 18 28.1%

  • what for?

    Votes: 21 32.8%

  • no way!

    Votes: 10 15.6%
  • Total voters
    64
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iwire said:
I would love to keep that attitude, however many companies are not treating the employee like that.

For example.



Emahler has said similar statements as well.

Like most things in life it is a two way street, the last company I was with for 10 years, I would have gone to the wall with them, until they let me know in no uncertain terms that I was just a tool to be used and put on the shelf when needed.

If that is how someone chooses to run their company that is their choice, my choice was to move on. :cool:
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no i haven't...i've complained about guys who think it's a one way street, with them on the receiving end...
 
emahler said:
no i haven't...i've complained about guys who think it's a one way street, with them on the receiving end...
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I am not going to go looking, I think the members are pretty aware of your positions on labor.
 
That should not matter.
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Oh I think a lot of things matter, I just didn't vote cause I felt it won't matter or change anthing in this Forum.
I frankly watch a lot of threads come across and I might be selfish as to not point out the obvious to the originator or to the responses presented. This is one of these cases.
I frankly waited to see what others have to commutate about the subject matter first.
I've made suggestions to what I thought might enhance this forum, but they were not public, I let it go.
If you are employed by an electrical company, you have a vested interest in how profitable that company is. The more money the company makes, the more it can pay it's employees.
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I work in the South, I has never been in any profit sharing of any sort at my level of employment, granted I might have been with the wrong companies. The small company's that I have worked for didn't share anything, OK a company party only cause other firms started offering them, small companies only care about the foreman, and their supervisors, that’s all I’ve ever seen, they only care that the other workers show up!
One can truly read between the lines here, of all of aspects talked about here and what go unsaid. Why should anyone state what they charge, bill, or there present pay level, its no ones business (IMO). Besides if you want to know the going rates call and ask for their service rates, I hope everyone lets there fingers do the shopping!

I do relish the heavy threads of doing business, but I don't ask for a copy of there business plan of even ask local scale questions to regional readers, this is none of my business.
Maybe its just the way I was raised, some hangover…
It might be well crazy for me to think about a business and not worry about scale rates, I have a real good idea what the true/active rates are around here, maybe I don't know exactly, but if I go, I'm going to be coming in at profitable rate!

I note who talks money and who doesn't. Those that have the money and business generally don't talk of how they bill it. If they do talk money its not rate based it problems with the money or cash flow or any other aspect of dealing with money and somewhat short or one might feel this is lacking something, yeah some exact answer, maybe. Those that don't understand business really need to get a sound foundation of business and money matters, before they get in the creek without a paddle.
If you do crappy work, and need to do it twice (or even 3 times) to get it right, then there's no raises or bonuses (or for that matter, no paycheck).
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Paragraphs and books are written on this subject matter! I don’t know how to truly present all aspects of what matters other than getting a job done
The point I try to get across to any one that’s works with me is a famous line from a movie. I'll use from George C. Scott playing Patton, "I don't like to pay for the same real estate twice". Wither he said that in real life I don't know, frankly I don't care.
Its my way to state to someone that they have to pay attention, I try to instill in them a sense of self worth. I ask my co-workers to grasp the total project first and will over-view all tasks involved to get'r done and that there their particular task is part of a sum to reach an end.
If employees would look at their employment not as 'just a paycheck every Friday' and instead treat it like a long-term career, better things will happen. Too many electricians need to chuck the "Pay's-the-same" attitude and start being a bit more fiscally responsible.
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I ponder that relationship of pushing people into some level of production all the time!
I often wonder how many people are truly happy with there level of production day in and day out, and have any good thoughts about this level of production based on their pay scale. I don't know why some people hang around this vocation. In most all cases they don't get to hang around with the "Right to Work" state that I work in. I know that there are people that will not work with me, and visa versa. I'm not at work for the friendship, I'm surely not at work for the hand holding. I've come to believe that in construction one learns how to read people, and pretty quickly at that.
I will work with any man / woman that will work as hard as I do, "I don't get paid to talk the job to death", Jude.
robwire said:
I think its a step in the right direction. It shouldn't be a closed door forum but you should have to be an actual contractor, not just work for one to post in it. I like to read this forum but it has really turned into a general electrical forum other then the name states. Too many people post in here that just work for someone else and lack the knowledge about contracting or are just engineers and have no clue what the game is all about. As for inspectors, they should give there input on code issues. Keep your friends close and your enemies even closer.
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Why so, it would just put a lot of paper work on someone desk, a whole array of work would be involved in determining who is a contractor, to qualify for this right to be in the closed door club, good luck with all that. Look at all the open aspects here, we always have 4 times the amount of guests here verses active users why should the guests get to read of "doing Business"? should we segregate only the guests not see the "doing business" section, it won't happen, What is it they say, "Forget about it"

You are exactly right “Many people post here”, some clueless, some sharp, all types, all types of interests and all types of situations.

“Too many people post in here that just work for someone else and lack the knowledge about contracting”, Yes daily, I don’t get paid to watch the bottom line, I do get paid to protect the wire!

“…or are just engineers and have no clue what the game is all about”
I frankly think that’s a very foolish statement, I have a personal friends that are EE’s and several Architects that I’ve had long conversations with as to the nature of construction.
The sum of the conversations is their drawings represent an application, its us in the trades that bring these drawings to life. Be it with the pitfalls, headaches, or anything else you might want to imply of the drawings you have to work with, and sometimes no drawings at all. Yes there are totally bad drawing, there’s also drawings that go without a hitch. Not so much unlike here, painfully reading through things that people shouldn’t be dealing with cause they don’t understand the aspect of the job, well no not so fast there! Getting an education of what should be done, by people that have already walked through an application of electrical work, its insight gained daily and I believe is great and relished by me and others as well.
Maybe the forum is becoming mundane, is one only reading a particular forum, I don’t think so, and certainly hope not!

Knowledge is Power, I wish everyone would go boost themselves up with some.

I hope the door stays open too, Thank Goodness for the Liberty we enjoy, and for the Liberty of not having answer a thread, selfish or otherwise!
 
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I think we need everyone to join in, to have a discussion that can lead to a debate of the issues.

Even in the group of contractors, they disagree on many issues, for example: Many think I am a fool for the way i manage my business, by not following the old command and control method, however it does not make it wrong to use other methods of managment, if we explore all the options, then we all can make informed decisions, having the board open, will allow more to contribuite with their views.
 
General Discussions et al

General Discussions et al

We have a business forum now: Electrical Contracting and Estimating/Management? yet it has become a catchall for non-business questions and general discussion and a how to thread, which at times become a bit tedious.

In the past I have seen business discussions side tracked by non-business owners, business owners referred to as ?robber barons?, and folks who have absolutely no clue about what it takes to run a contracting business at all come in and say asinine things like ?business owners have no risk at all, and all they do is get rich off us?.

Quite honestly there would probably be much more in-depth and constructive business discussions without the general discussions and disgruntled labor chiming in and taking the occasional pot shots.

As it is I say way too much and even go back an delete some posts just, and I heavily edit.

If the mods decide to do anything they should just change the name of this forum to General discussions, because that is basically what it is.
 
ITO said:
We have a business forum now: Electrical Contracting and Estimating/Management? yet it has become a catchall for non-business questions and general discussion and a how to thread, which at times become a bit tedious.

In the past I have seen business discussions side tracked by non-business owners, business owners referred to as ?robber barons?, and folks who have absolutely no clue about what it takes to run a contracting business at all come in and say asinine things like ?business owners have no risk at all, and all they do is get rich off us?.

Quite honestly there would probably be much more in-depth and constructive business discussions without the general discussions and disgruntled labor chiming in and taking the occasional pot shots.

As it is I say way too much and even go back an delete some posts just, and I heavily edit.

If the mods decide to do anything they should just change the name of this forum to General discussions, because that is basically what it is.
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I agree 100%. And I would think that adding a general discussion thread might help and the Mods could move all the non business related topics there. Sometimes NEC questions are asked here and not in the NEC area. I am sure the mods have better things to do than move posts around but thats what I think they should do.
 
ITO said:
We have a business forum now: Electrical Contracting and Estimating/Management? yet it has become a catchall for non-business questions and general discussion and a how to thread, which at times become a bit tedious.

In the past I have seen business discussions side tracked by non-business owners, business owners referred to as ?robber barons?, and folks who have absolutely no clue about what it takes to run a contracting business at all come in and say asinine things like ?business owners have no risk at all, and all they do is get rich off us?.

Quite honestly there would probably be much more in-depth and constructive business discussions without the general discussions and disgruntled labor chiming in and taking the occasional pot shots.

As it is I say way too much and even go back an delete some posts just, and I heavily edit.

If the mods decide to do anything they should just change the name of this forum to General discussions, because that is basically what it is.
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I also agree that a new topic for "general questions" would be better that creating a new area that will lead persons without access to complain or demean those with access. The same amount of time that would be used to screen members for access could be better used to monitor the Electrical Contracting and Estimating/Management area for off topic posts and move them. There is no reason for any information not to be posted for the general public to see. I, and probably most contractors, are not in this business to deceive customers or employees, so I'm not worried about what is posted.

My vote is for no new topic.
 
im glad

im glad

i'm glad i have stirred up a little debate about this. I as a business owner have nothing to hide, I just wish some other posters would also be as open, especially when they have a lot of knowledge about certain things. I would like to see maybe 1 person a week post some advice or knowledge about something they know, instead of havig to think of every possible question to get the right answers. I am a member of this forum for 1 reason, to gain knowledge. I realise that the more I learn, the less i Know! I have been in business for just over a year and I've got a lot to learn. I have done pretty well for the first year, now I want to kick it up a notch, but to do this, i need ideas, things that work and things that don't. I am a small company at the moment, but i aim to be the biggest and best EC in town within 5 years. All help is appreciated!:smile:
 
480sparky said:
godfather.jpg


Family. It's all about family.​
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That guy in the picture is from you tubes "Charlie Bit me"
 
I voted for "what for?".

You can always us the PM function if you don't want the "public" to know what you think. I believe the open policy here is best. Next, the engineers will want an 'engineer only' section. I am not an engineer, and I would be very sad if I could not look in on engineering debates.

The open policy is best. (IMO of course).
 
adamants said:
i'm glad i have stirred up a little debate about this. I as a business owner have nothing to hide, I just wish some other posters would also be as open, especially when they have a lot of knowledge about certain things. I would like to see maybe 1 person a week post some advice or knowledge about something they know, instead of havig to think of every possible question to get the right answers. I am a member of this forum for 1 reason, to gain knowledge. I realise that the more I learn, the less i Know! I have been in business for just over a year and I've got a lot to learn. I have done pretty well for the first year, now I want to kick it up a notch, but to do this, i need ideas, things that work and things that don't. I am a small company at the moment, but i aim to be the biggest and best EC in town within 5 years. All help is appreciated!:smile:
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no offense adam, but i side with ITO...i too am a business owner, and while i think i give entirely too much information out sometimes, i have a lot to hide...there are a lot of things that we have learned/mastered/acquired/etc throughout the years of being business that I am not going to openly share with anyone...some things are proprietary issues and others just help me carve out a niche and earn a good living (and i'm not ready to clue others into it so they can ruin it for me)

you have been in business for about a year, and still have a positive outlook on the industry and contractors...that will change...

good luck.
 
Moderators--- please take as much time screening threads for placement in the proper topic as you do screening for union vs. non union, and making sure most posts are "family friendly".

the following is an example of a post that should be moved to the "NEC" topic instead of the current location.


Code Question?

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A young project manager in our office is questioning my logic of not wanting to install a 400 amp sub-panel into a crowded mechanical room directly under the plumbing and steam piping laterals. I told him that I wanted to move all the gear over to a clean and clear adjacent wall. He re-buffed that the GC won't go for it. I checked NEC and could not find any info regarding power panels with water / steam piping overhead - but do seem to remember a ruling regarding this. Can anyone lend some input...


I mean no disrespect, but the topic headings are there for a reason.
 
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