For years we have behind the plumbers in pay, they always made a buck or two more per hour than us. even on the contractor level the could always charge 5 to 10 bucks more a hour. I wonder if the reason we caught them or even passed them is because of technolgy. ???
catching the plumbers
- Thread starter pgordon
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chris kennedy
Senior Member
- Location
- Miami Fla.
- Occupation
- 60 yr old tool twisting electrician
pgordon said:
The wife is up my butt all the time because I get a lot of better offers. I love what I do and thats that!
GilbeSpark
Senior Member
- Location
- NC
chris kennedy said:
Same here. I've had offers, without me looking for them, making a couple bucks more per hour. Fact is I like where I work.
- Location
- Massachusetts
pgordon said:
Who says we did catch them?
In my area plumbers charge and make much more then ECs.
goldstar
Senior Member
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
Here also. But the most important thing is that they all stick together and charge the same exorbitant fees whereas we tend to cut each others throat to land a job. Some of the contractor's associations in my area publish a sheet (for their own members) showing typical prices for service upgrades, 15 thru 50 amp circuit runs, etc. as a guide line for their members. This is not an attempt at price fixing but rather an attempt to keep their membership in a fairly close competitive environment. I suppose some would argue the other way but I believe if we don't keep our prices in line with what the local economies will bear then we'll always be working for a mere wage.iwire said:
brian john
Senior Member
- Location
- Leesburg, VA
Around here plumbers and HVAC contractors charge more and make more. So do the elevator guys.
khixxx said:
I am laughing so hard I need a rest, years ago I joined the state contractors assn. the members were talking about how cheap they could do a job and how low they they could out bid the other guy, they were proud of how easy they could slash the prices.
I left that assn and never looked back, they are the same group today, pushing for more CEU hours.
brian john
Senior Member
- Location
- Leesburg, VA
You read all the time how doctors cover for bad doctors, lawyers do the same for their brethren as do teachers. But electricians are the first to trash the other guy for any reason, true or not.
Except for the plumbers in wellesly That charge a flat rate. $350 to start ,
check up front, I think we have caught them. with all the tech stuff out there, Voice and data. Lighting systems. and the big one FIRE ALARM.
Fire Alarm alone makes up 25 % of a commercial build out.Test contracts
Monitoring contracts. Service contracts all are big bucks. and are required by law . How about cat6, big buck stuff. how about lutron lighting systems
add 1/3 more to the job. with all these ,the cost of doing the same size job
has risin and risin. and a jon is still a jon.
check up front, I think we have caught them. with all the tech stuff out there, Voice and data. Lighting systems. and the big one FIRE ALARM.
Fire Alarm alone makes up 25 % of a commercial build out.Test contracts
Monitoring contracts. Service contracts all are big bucks. and are required by law . How about cat6, big buck stuff. how about lutron lighting systems
add 1/3 more to the job. with all these ,the cost of doing the same size job
has risin and risin. and a jon is still a jon.
- Location
- Massachusetts
pgordon said:
Yes I agree with those systems which for the most part are not in residential service work.
The hourly rate for basic residential electric work is well under what plumbers charge.
Installing fans, lights, repairing receptacles etc. is still being done for low hourly rates.
I have never seen a plumber have a lower hourly rate for changing washers and a higher hourly rate for their more complicated work.
crossman
Senior Member
- Location
- Southeast Texas
What if every journeyman electrician in a given area stood up and demanded a certain minimum hourly wage? That might help stabilize the going rates in the market and would make it harder for any particular EC to drastically undercut the market. But, I guess that wouldn't really stop the one-man shops from low-balling.
The electrical rate for residential new-construction down here in Texas is crazy-low. Reason is, there are tons of "helpers" who don't know anything about electrical work except "drill the holes where I marked the X" and "pull that yellow romex from there to there" and "nail the boxes on everywhere I painted a red mark". And there are thousands of these guys willing to work for 7 to 8 bucks an hour.
As for state licensing, these helpers pay $20 to the state each year for an "apprenitce" license and they will work the next 40 years with nothing but that apprentice license.
The electrical rate for residential new-construction down here in Texas is crazy-low. Reason is, there are tons of "helpers" who don't know anything about electrical work except "drill the holes where I marked the X" and "pull that yellow romex from there to there" and "nail the boxes on everywhere I painted a red mark". And there are thousands of these guys willing to work for 7 to 8 bucks an hour.
As for state licensing, these helpers pay $20 to the state each year for an "apprenitce" license and they will work the next 40 years with nothing but that apprentice license.
crossman
Senior Member
- Location
- Southeast Texas
satcom said:
No, the apprentice license doesn't allow them to be a contractor. What does happen is this: There is a 50 house neighborhood going in. For an EC to have a chance of obtaining this job, he can only pay a decent wage to one or two electricians who know what they are doing. They may get $18 to $20 per hour. The remainder of the labor will be $8 per hour helpers with state apprentice licenses. These "apprentices" are not provided with classes, are not taught anythng beyond "drill this hole" and "pull this romex" and typically have very little opportunity for advancement.
But, I guess that is what the new residential market is, and the ECs have to compete, so they all do the same thing essentially.
BryanMD
Senior Member
crossman said:50 house neighborhood going in...
one or two electricians,.. may get $18 to $20...
the labor will be $8 per hour helpers
But, I guess that is what the new residential market is...
Is and I suspect always will be.
but it isn't necessarily a "Bad Thing".
(tract resi new work might be the best first job choice you can make)
Of those 20 or so raw green $8/hr guys on that crew how may will 'get it' and move up? Not enough for the EC to pay more than the $8 until they show they are worth more. But for the 2 or 3 that do get it? they'll be able to apply those early lessons every day for the rest of their career.
If that low end EC isn't offering an ABC (or union) Apprenticeship program it is up to them to make the moves required to get the training. After as little as 3-6 months on that tract resi crew their next employer will get a guy who is (probably) worth investing something in.
The larger question is why the "real electricians" stick around for $18/hr to run a nursery school.
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HighWirey
Senior Member
- Location
- Cocoa, Florida, USA
"getting EC's to work together is harder than getting Israel and Palestine to make up"
'Ho Ho Ho !'
"electricians are the first to trash the other guy for any reason"
On an individual basis, back when I worked fair, the membership used to call it 'the international mutherhood of brother stemmers'. Some things will never change . . .
Merry Christmas Everyone and Best Wishes
'Ho Ho Ho !'
"electricians are the first to trash the other guy for any reason"
On an individual basis, back when I worked fair, the membership used to call it 'the international mutherhood of brother stemmers'. Some things will never change . . .
Merry Christmas Everyone and Best Wishes
emahler said:
I fully agree. well maybe it could be a underground fight club...
I buy real estate now and again. The local REI has about 800 plus people. They send out monthly letters and offer seminars at a cost. blabllblblabbla. If you think EC is competitive, try buying a property $.50 to the dollar. It does amaze me how many guys that make good money in Real Estate help out others. The club keeps up to date on new laws that will effect them. One voice does little but if you get 50 voices then you have something more. A smaller club meets at Eat n Park for an hour lunch once a month. It's more of a meet n great.
I am sure you all know networking is one of the best tools for everyone.
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