Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

[bphgravity]

In a large retail book store, there is a section of the store that consists of a cafe coffee bar. The area is around 30' by 30' with space for sitting. At the counter there are several appliances for coffee type drinks, refrigerators, grinders, bagel toasters, weight scale, computer and cash register. There is no sink in the main bar. There is a small doorless room behind the coffee bar where a freezer, refrigerator, and sink/wash station is located.

Does the entire encompassing area being called the cafe area qualify as a kitchen or should each work location be considered separately?

The big problem is that the coffe bar comes "pre-wired" with recpetacle strips for appliance service. There are two IG receptacles and a few additional receptacles in the area are multiwire. Nothing is gfci protected.

What is your call?

[ May 30, 2005, 06:48 AM: Message edited by: bphgravity ]

 

[jwelectric]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

(2) Commercial and institutional kitchens ? for the purposes of this section, a kitchen is an area with a sink and permanent facilities for food preparation and cooking

The key word in the sentence above is AREA. In a bath room where the basin is separated by a door form the toilet, tub, or shower is still a bathroom is it not?

 

[mdshunk]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

If the coffee bar is prewired, does it have a UL label and does it have an attachment cord? I might tend to call the whole coffee bar an "appliance" or "utilization equipment" if that was the case. I've wired a few premanufactured mall kiosks where food is served that the inspector felt fell into this category. I can see this going either way.

 

[infinity]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

(2) Commercial and institutional kitchens ? for the purposes of this section, a kitchen is an area with a sink and permanent facilities for food preparation and cooking

Would anyone consider making coffee and toasting bagels 'cooking'? IMO it isn't.

 

[jwelectric]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

Originally posted by infinity:

(2) Commercial and institutional kitchens ? for the purposes of this section, a kitchen is an area with a sink and permanent facilities for food preparation and cooking

Would anyone consider making coffee and toasting bagels 'cooking'? IMO it isn't.

Would anyone consider making coffee and toasting bagels "food preparation"?

I would.

 

[infinity]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

Yes, but the quote said food prep and cooking.

 

[jwelectric]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

cook (k k)
v. cooked, cook?ing, cooks
v. tr.
1. To prepare (food) for eating by applying heat.

I have always referred to making coffee as cooking a pot of coffee. By definition it is cooking.

 

[infinity]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

We can debate if making coffee is cooking but the point is moot. According to the original post there is no sink in the area where the "cooking" is taking place so by definition it's not a commercial kitchen.

 

[dillon3c]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

Originally posted by bphgravity:
There is a samll doorless room behind the coffee bar where a freezer, refrigerator, and sink/wash station is located.

In this aboved discribed(doorless)area,you make no mention in this facilties area, for providing of any food preparation,what so ever.

In my opinion,this would in fact be all-encompassing,in the preparation of food..All,including this counter area.

 

[paul]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

You're dabating over semantics now. As mdshunk said, it's the inspector's call here. Give him a call on the phone and see what he has to say about it before you continue on.

 

[dillon3c]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

Paul,
The man who author this thread asked...

"Whats your call"...= opinions..

 

[iwire]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

Originally posted by paul:
You're dabating over semantics now. As mdshunk said, it's the inspector's call here.

I think this question is being asked by an inspector who just wants some input.

Without having seen the 'area' I would say it sounds like a kitchen.

Interesting point mdshunk about the possibility of the unit being UL listed as it is.

 

[George Stolz]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

Sounds like a kitchen.

 

[ryan_618]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

I honestly would not callit a kitchen.

My opinion my be different if I saw it, but from the description, I would say no.

Ryan

 

[luke warmwater]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

Smells like a kitchen too.

Now I'm hungry.

I'm off to Dunkin Doughnuts!

 

[aelectricalman]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

Originally posted by infinity:

...permanent facilities for food preparation and cooking.

A toaster is not a permanent means of cooking.

My 2 cents

 

[infinity]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

A toaster is not a permanent means of cooking.

My 2 cents

--------------------
Chris Hill

Chris, I'm with you and Ryan on this one.

 

[aelectricalman]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

However, this goes back to "Intent". I feel it was the code making panels "Intent" that this be a kitchen. In my eyes, if it smells like a kitchen, acts like a kitchen, looks like a kitchen. It must be a kitchen!

 

[aelectricalman]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

And, he spelled coffee wrong.

 

[ryan_618]

Re: Coffee Bar a Kitchen?

Originally posted by aelectricalman:
However, this goes back to "Intent". I feel it was the code making panels "Intent" that this be a kitchen. In my eyes, if it smells like a kitchen, acts like a kitchen, looks like a kitchen. It must be a kitchen!

If I have a sink and 3 cord and plug connected microwaves sitting on a shelf, with a flashing neo sign that says "kitchen", it's still not a kitchen.

I think the CMP's intent is just what the definition says, not whether or not it looks and smells like a kitchen.