customers comment on Bid. what the

[bradleyelectric]

here is the other guys quote from the customer.

no way is he making any money on $1042.00 permit cost is $60.00

this is ridiculass.

The first guy quoted around $1800 for everything and the guy we went with was $1042.40 for everything

The only way to make money doing service work is to not get in a bidding war. To many people are working for less than wages because they know how to do the work and bought a truck. Market to those that are looking for a professional that is convienient and can make them feel comfortable. If you can't make a potential customer feel comfortable enough to award you the job without getting 3 prices learn how.

 

[satcom]

That may be true but as I've said many times, If that gets his bills paid for another month then good for him.

The idea of operating a business, is to do better then wages, but when your down to just meeting bills, it may be time to look for a different business, or even a job with benifits.

 

[dbuckley]

At least the customer responded, and responded politely, and thanked you.

Some days can be much worse tha that!

 

[electricmanscott]

The idea of operating a business, is to do better then wages, but when your down to just meeting bills, it may be time to look for a different business, or even a job with benifits.

Yah, or try to battle through a historic economic crisis and hope to get out alive by any means necessary.

 

[readydave8]

I agree that there will always be a low-ball bidder. Someone will bid jobs too low and be out of business in a few years, sometimes it takes a while for it to catch up to him, but he will go broke. But a new low-ball bidder will come along to take his place.

If your getting jobs by low price alone, you will always be working for customers that would rather not pay more for a better value.

The answer may be to sell value--good quality work, prompt reliable service. If it works you will wind up with customers that are willing to pay more for better value, and you should make more money than the lo-ball bidder.

A few years ago I noticed that the electricians that charged way high and everyone complained about their prices, were also the electricians that made more money than the low bidder guys.

It may not work for everyone, I've done it both ways. Now I'm down to working by myself most of the time and hiring other electricians as needed to keep up, and I'm finally making good money.

 

[RonPecinaJr]

Yah, or try to battle through a historic economic crisis and hope to get out alive by any means necessary.

That's how I feel right about now and by going above and beyond customer expectations by golly things are slowly but surely working themselves out.

 

[ptonsparky]

I would have considered you as the "low-baller". Low for even here.
Your suppliers can lock in the prices for wire & conduit. Just ask them at the time they give you pricing, then offer the same to your customer.

 

[rt66electric]

small town gossip

small town gossip

Be sure to follow up on who the low bidder is. Ask the building inspector who pulled the permit? The next time you see the low-baller at the supply house, politely inform him of the going rate for service changes. He will soon decide to raise his prices in order to make as much money as you do. I often "blab" my prices, usually slightly higher than what I really charge, similar to sandbagging in a poker game. As a courtesy to other starving contractors, If I'm not interested in a particular job, I will bid high. If he is busy working,He is not lowballing the jobs I want..

 

[growler]

It's really a matter of luck when bidding a job what you can charge if price is all that matters. Around here there are hundreds of contractors. If you were to bid that job at say $2500 there would be a chance that you would get it if they other two companies bidding were the right one's.

This is why I ask who else is bidding the job if possible. I don't need to know the numbers but if I know the companies then I will have a pretty good idea where they are at price wise. I aslo know when I'm pretty much wasting my time because I really can't get that low so unless I can sell on something other than price it's a lost cause.

The guy with the $1800 bid may be the high man in this crowd but with a different set of contractor involved he may be the low man. Not everyone is out there low balling and that's just a mistake that people make thinking that's how it works.

 

[ishium 80439]

Based on your scope I would have been in the $1900-$2200 range. Obviously every service is different, some being slam dunk's and other's being major PIA's, but for this area I think your number was sound. I keep reverting back to the axiom that price is only a small part of value.

 

[~Shado~]

Based on your scope I would have been in the $1900-$2200 range. Obviously every service is different, some being slam dunk's and other's being major PIA's, but for this area I think your number was sound. I keep reverting back to the axiom that price is only a small part of value.

Really? $6/amp for a service upgrade?

Have things gotten that bad?

I'm more in line with your figure of about $8-10/amp, average ballpark.

 

[e57]

Really? $6/amp for a service upgrade?

Have things gotten that bad?

I'm more in line with your figure of about $8-10/amp, average ballpark.

You bill or estimate by the ampere?!?!?
Do you have a factor for complicated jobs? UG?

 

[~Shado~]

You bill or estimate by the ampere?!?!?
Do you have a factor for complicated jobs? UG?

No...wish it were that simple....but as stated...AVERAGE BALLPARK figures, based on past jobs thru the years.

Yes...each job is unique, and as such requires proper intel to ascertain appropriate figures. (Joo know that!!!! :roll: )

As far as UG....here, POCO owns up to the meter...so I have always relocated / kept meter on the home. (Several older areas have trans pad with up to '4' HO meters on the trans, in someones back yard.)
Then POCO has to trench and land in meter. Lets them have and keep liability for issues in HO yards.

((On a side note...wouldn't billing or estimating by the amp be considered a form of.....Flat Rate?.....))

Really trying to work out proper figures to accomodate Flat Rates as a whole....as I can see some real advantages to it.

 

[~Shado~]

timed out to edit above....

The only 'factor' I know is the PITA!!!

Never could quite understand how to properly caclulate/figure the so called 'factor figure'...percents seem too inconsistant or unreliable. So, I just take each job and add time to it if needed.


And with Flat Rates...I have had a very rough form created in Excel for quite some time....but then CELTIC had to post some examples of his, and forced me to virtuly do a complete rebuild of mine....still having issues getting it together.

 

[LarryFine]

Really? $6/amp for a service upgrade?

Does it only take half the labor for a 100a service as compared to a 200a? That's weird. I only charge less by the equipment cost difference.

 

[~Shado~]

Does it only take half the labor for a 100a service as compared to a 200a? That's weird. I only charge less by the equipment cost difference.

Not sure where you are going or asking Larry....

 

[petersonra]

Yah, or try to battle through a historic economic crisis and hope to get out alive by any means necessary.

yep. a lot of businesses are not in a position to be choosey and have to be low priced just to stick around long enough to have a chance to make some money down the road.

If you go out of business during a slump, you won't be around to get back in on the good times when/if they return.

I was at a company today on a service call. They are down from 130 employees to about 60. The 60 people left are on 50 hours a week because it is more cost effective to pay OT than to hire people back and have to pay benefits to them. Sucks for those who can't find work, but the company is doing OK financially. The company won't help anyone if it goes under.

 

[Riograndeelectric]

Based on your scope I would have been in the $1900-$2200 range. Obviously every service is different, some being slam dunk's and other's being major PIA's, but for this area I think your number was sound. I keep reverting back to the axiom that price is only a small part of value.

Well I am glad to know that you were not the guy that bid 1042. back when there was lots of work and prices were good I would have bid the job around $1800.00 but I knew I would get the job at that price I knew I could make it on the $1460.00 I bid.

realistically I could have left the existing meter in place as the original service was 125A and believe the mete should have been rated for the 200A
load. when this house was originally wired the mater was provide by Excel energy so it should have been rated for 200A.

I just really wonder if the other guy is even pulling a permit.

I have run across 3 service changes in the last 4 months that were not permitted , the panels were replaced with 150A main breaker however the riser conductors were not replaced and were only rated for 100A and 100A rated meter. and no new water pipe ground and Ground rod.



I had 1 HO call me up and chew me out over the phone when excel sent a tech out to look at the service that was un permitted and forced the HO to fix the violations and pull a permit.

 

[LarryFine]

Not sure where you are going or asking Larry....

I'm wondering how/why someone would price a 100a service at half of what they would a 200a service. The labor is almost identical, and the parts costs aren't that far apart.

I never price a job by the anything. I'd rather drive there and know about the inevitable snag before I give a price.

 

[LarryFine]

I have run across 3 service changes in the last 4 months that were not permitted , the panels were replaced with 150A main breaker however the riser conductors were not replaced and were only rated for 100A and 100A rated meter. and no new water pipe ground and Ground rod.

I had two of those in recently-purchased homes, both of which received rave reviews about the service in their HI reports.

The first one resulted in a new couple with a new baby being without power for over a week because the POCO pulled the meter after one of the 100a line cable lugs melted. Funny that the 200a load cable lugs didn't.

I had to do a service-change's worth of work in the panel to get power. The newly-installed central AC system had nothing done correctly. The AC compressor was tapped from a baseboard heater in the den. Rave review. :roll:

The second resulted in a fire during a storm. Somehow the incoming neutral became energized, and the EGC in the NM feeding the water heater caught fire. I found that the #10 EGC was the only "GEC" in the house.

Once again, there was the 200a loadside cable in the 100a meter base with the original SE cable up the wall. There were zero cable clamps in the QO panel, and zero grounding. This was also part of a central AC install.

This one also had a special mention about the great service upgrade. It's a small wonder I have no particular love for HI's. I almost had to reroute a compliant SE cable for a friend for its being too close to a window, which it wasnt.

They thought the 3' rule was all-inclusive, but I straightened them out, with code references and everything. My friend sold the house without issue. (I wonder if I should offer my services to that company?)

I had 1 HO call me up and chew me out over the phone when excel sent a tech out to look at the service that was un permitted and forced the HO to fix the violations and pull a permit.

Right, like it wasn't dangerous or illegal until you called. :roll: