Davis-Bacon

[fbhwt]

They are absolutely wrong. If you do the job, you get the pay. period. no questions. go directly to Dep't of Labor, et al. and get someone to go after your money for you.

That's the way I understand it, I have been talking to the DOL, the fella I talked to suggested contacting the contracting agency and ask about the certified payroll, I'm getting the run around, job #2 there saying something about it was a prime contract and was not classified as construction, I had to read the DBA to her, said she would have to talk to there attorneys, job #3 says he couldn't do anything unless I gave him a purchase order number, I told him to call my ex-employer I'm sure he could help him out with that.
I have dates, number of men on the job, hours worked, I even have the work order givin to me from my ex-employer for the work to be done. This is not just about me it's about the other guys that worked with me sweating our butts off trying to make a livin.

 

[growler]

Most working foremen I know spend a good bit of time with a clipboard, and supervising, and ordering and staging materials, and at most, a few hours per day with tools.

I understand what you are saying but if a company was allowed just to call a foreman or leadman management then there would be a lot of supervisors on a job.

If you are needed to work with tools then you are an electrician and not a laborer and not management. This just blocks off two loopholes that companies would try to use to keep from paying prevailing wage ( in high paying areas).

 

[nakulak]

I have worked on many davis bacon jobs, and it is my understanding that anyone who picks up a pair of pliars or strips a wire is to be paid electricians wages. apprentices can fall in a catagory where they are paid a portion of a jmans wages based on the percentage completion of their schooling.

 

[BryanMD]

The requirement that contractors pay "prevailing" wages to weatherization employees is holding up hundreds of millions in stimulus spending, a new government report suggests. The stimulus act provided states with $5 billion for weatherization over three years. Almost half the money has been disbursed, but more than half the states that the Government Accountability Office contacted hadn't started weatherizing houses as of the end of August.


Here's what the Heritage Foundation said about David-Bacon in February:
Congress has included a little-known provision in the economic stimulus legislation that wastes tax dollars and costs jobs. All $188 billion worth of construction projects funded in the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act (H.R. 1) must pay Davis-Bacon prevailing wage rates. This requirement will inflate construction costs by $17 billion and depress the economy.

local paper blog:
http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/business/hancock/blog/2009/09/prevailing_wage_requirements_d.html

 

[Leestarkweather]

I don't think the fact that the job site is a military contractor means that it is a prevailing wage job. In the last 30 years I did hundreds of jobs at Litton Data Systems and Litton Controls (now part of Northrop) and at Hughes Missile Systems. We have never been a union shop or paid prevailing wages. My best foreman (with me 28 years) makes more than union scale and better benefits, especially SEP IRA at 25% of wages and profit sharing, too.

"Prevailing wage" is a misnomer if there ever was one. If all the wages in any area were accurately surveyed and then a database was prepared, the "prevailing wage" (let's say the most common 10%) would be a lot different than the union scale.

What the taxpayer needs is a complete rewrite of how the tax money is spent, and the words "merit" and "competence" should be throughout the statutes. All the time spent on certified payrolls and other reports should be spent on competent jobsite inspections of the work being installed, and I am not talking about 2 inspections for a whole project's electrical work.

Los Angeles USD has decade after decade of bond money that has been approved by the voters, and it is very poorly spent. There are constant cost overruns, crap workmanship, and every type of conniving scheme possible (i.e. joint partnerships of 10 tradesmen all being partners, double breasted shops rotating crews on and off the DB jobs, etc.) to obtain the jobs. How about true competition with competent (unbribable) continuing inspection.

My 2 cents worth, from an old fart.

 

[fbhwt]

prevailing wage

prevailing wage

I don't think the fact that the job site is a military contractor means that it is a prevailing wage job. In the last 30 years I did hundreds of jobs at Litton Data Systems and Litton Controls (now part of Northrop) and at Hughes Missile Systems. We have never been a union shop or paid prevailing wages. My best foreman (with me 28 years) makes more than union scale and better benefits, especially SEP IRA at 25% of wages and profit sharing, too.

"Prevailing wage" is a misnomer if there ever was one. If all the wages in any area were accurately surveyed and then a database was prepared, the "prevailing wage" (let's say the most common 10%) would be a lot different than the union scale.

What the taxpayer needs is a complete rewrite of how the tax money is spent, and the words "merit" and "competence" should be throughout the statutes. All the time spent on certified payrolls and other reports should be spent on competent jobsite inspections of the work being installed, and I am not talking about 2 inspections for a whole project's electrical work.

Los Angeles USD has decade after decade of bond money that has been approved by the voters, and it is very poorly spent. There are constant cost overruns, crap workmanship, and every type of conniving scheme possible (i.e. joint partnerships of 10 tradesmen all being partners, double breasted shops rotating crews on and off the DB jobs, etc.) to obtain the jobs. How about true competition with competent (unbribable) continuing inspection.

My 2 cents worth, from an old fart.

If the work being done for the government contractor is funded by the government then prevailing wages apply.


http://www.dol.gov/compliance/guide/dbra.htm

 

[mkgrady]

If the work being done for the government contractor is funded by the government then prevailing wages apply.


http://www.dol.gov/compliance/guide/dbra.htm

You should also know that if a supervisor or foremann work even a small portion of their time with tools then they are covered for all hours by prevailing wage requirements. I think the number is 25%.

It doesn't matter if the worker has a license, in fact you do not need a license of any kind to work on any federal property. On a Davis-Bacon job, the only exception to paying the full prevailing wage is if you are in a state approved apprentice program. In that case there is a scale of wages that are paid based on time worked in the program. That scale is published in the wage decision.

If you have a written record of the work you did on a DB job you are going to get your money unless the contractor goes out of business. It may take a long time to collect though. If your company was a subcontractor, the DOL will go after the prime contractor for you.

 

[fbhwt]

How could this be?

How could this be?

I am being told by the government contractor that hired the company I use to work for that there was nothing in the contract about prevailing wage or Davis-Bacon act, I have talked to DOL and they said they have never heard of such a thing, also that I need to talk to the "contracting officer" with the Navy who is the contracting agency. I called the command labor advisor but was unable to talk to anyone at this time. Is there anyway that Davis-Bacon and prevailing wage would not apply? The work done was on a naval installation, in a building used for training, I relocated electrical panels both 60 and 400hz
installed new electrical panels, transformers and a large UPS system.

 

[Leestarkweather]

If the work being done for the government contractor is funded by the government then prevailing wages apply.


http://www.dol.gov/compliance/guide/dbra.htm

Thanks for the reference--I have copied the first paragraph. Maybe it will help explain some of the misconceptions here.

"Who is Covered

The Davis-Bacon and Related Acts apply to contractors and subcontractors performing on federally funded or assisted contracts in excess of $2,000 for the construction, alteration, or repair (including painting and decorating) of public buildings or public works."

None of the contracts I referred to were done in public buildings or public works. They were performed on the (privately owned) premises of the defense contractors. Yes, they were publicly funded with federal tax dollars from the DOD, but that does not make them subject to Davis Bacon. We were doing everything from office buildouts to chem labs to IT rooms and their related MG sets (400HZ) etc.

It's where it is located, too, not just who is paying for it.

 

[mkgrady]

I am being told by the government contractor that hired the company I use to work for that there was nothing in the contract about prevailing wage or Davis-Bacon act, I have talked to DOL and they said they have never heard of such a thing, also that I need to talk to the "contracting officer" with the Navy who is the contracting agency. I called the command labor advisor but was unable to talk to anyone at this time. Is there anyway that Davis-Bacon and prevailing wage would not apply? The work done was on a naval installation, in a building used for training, I relocated electrical panels both 60 and 400hz
installed new electrical panels, transformers and a large UPS system.

It seems like this would be covered by Davis-Bacon. Go to the Navy base. You are looking for the Resident Officer in Charge of Construction (ROICC). The guard shack workers will tell you where that office is.

Tell the ROICC you think you were not paid prevailing wages on one of his contracts. Describe to the ROICC the building number, the prime contractor name, the project name (or describe what was going on), the work you did and how much you were paid per hour.

 

[fbhwt]

It seems like this would be covered by Davis-Bacon. Go to the Navy base. You are looking for the Resident Officer in Charge of Construction (ROICC). The guard shack workers will tell you where that office is.

Tell the ROICC you think you were not paid prevailing wages on one of his contracts. Describe to the ROICC the building number, the prime contractor name, the project name (or describe what was going on), the work you did and how much you were paid per hour.

Thanks, I'll do that

 

[sameguy]

Call the I.B.E.W. in your area, I am sure they will be happy to help you and the other guys.

 

[fbhwt]

Call the I.B.E.W. in your area, I am sure they will be happy to help you and the other guys.

Just curious, what might the I.B.E.W. be able to do? I have contacted the DOL,WHD, U.S.Navy and state government, I have been very busy, on the phone and computer, I could use a lawyer but can't afford one. I have filed for unemployment, have a hearing set up with the employment commision since I quit my job, can't work for someone that's cheating me. I did find out today that one of the government jobs my ex-employer told was not prevailing wage actually was. Still getting the run around with the one with the Navy, Lockheed-Martin people saying the have to review the contract, I feel pretty sure if the other one was this one will be too.

 

[TxShocker]

Just curious, what might the I.B.E.W. be able to do? I have contacted the DOL,WHD, U.S.Navy and state government, I have been very busy, on the phone and computer, I could use a lawyer but can't afford one. I have filed for unemployment, have a hearing set up with the employment commision since I quit my job, can't work for someone that's cheating me. I did find out today that one of the government jobs my ex-employer told was not prevailing wage actually was. Still getting the run around with the one with the Navy, Lockheed-Martin people saying the have to review the contract, I feel pretty sure if the other one was this one will be too.

The IBEW is well known for going after contractors that do not pay prevailing wage. They have been there done that, so they will help you or better yet they will probably do it for you.

 

[fbhwt]

The IBEW is well known for going after contractors that do not pay prevailing wage. They have been there done that, so they will help you or better yet they will probably do it for you.

Thanks for the input, I've done alot of investigative work, can't begin to think about how hard it would be without the internet, got alot of help and advise here, Thank you all!

 

[sameguy]

what TXSHOCKER said.