Dealing with inflexible workers

[480sparky]

True, but right now the labor pool is pretty heavy with good talent. I think Marc is in a good place to be particular with who he hires and not have to deal with stuff like this.

Word has it he may have a position open up soon.... Maybe you ought to apply, Pete!

 

[peter d]

Word has it he may have a position open up soon.... Maybe you ought to apply, Pete!

We look too much alike...people would get us confused.

 

[Karl H]

Dennis I almost fell out of my chair laughing at your
photo in post #34! Good Show!

If you've been on this forum for awhile and you do'nt
laugh at that.Your a machine!

 

[mkgrady]

He's an at will employee anyhow. I don't even need a reason, frankly.

I agree with you, but I have seen numerous discrimination suits in our trade where an at will employee in a protected class (over 40, race, gender, etc.) filed a suit after being let go. In every case the lawyers made a lot of money for very little work. In every case the plaintiff walked away with some money they didn't deserve.

 

[220/221]

Peter. There is a LOT more top being a boss than simply being a strong authority figure. In a black and white world with an unlimited and equal labor supply, a bosses job would be easy. Just fire #25146 and #25147 would step right in.

Being a small contractor requires the OWNERS to be the flexible ones. We have to look at the strengths and weaknesses of all the people that work for us and determine how to best utilize them.

You are not going to get perfection. If he was perfect, he wouldn't be working for you.

If he is 73 and still earning money, there is no problem. You KNOW is capabilities and his limitations. Use that info and build a solid working relationship. Don't ruin the last few years of the old guy's life by trying to change him. Sit down and tell him how glad you are to have him working with you.

 

[growler]

If he is 73 and still earning money, there is no problem. You KNOW is capabilities and his limitations. Use that info and build a solid working relationship. Don't ruin the last few years of the old guy's life by trying to change him. Sit down and tell him how glad you are to have him working with you.

I like that attitude. I was thinking that maybe he could just ask the man in some informal way what the problem is.

Some people at that age and even earlier in life have trouble with finding their way to different jobs and then dealing with a strange situations. At that age maybe he needs to work with a helper or something.

Instead of trying to get him to perform as a full blown journeyman, have him work at a reduced rate doing easier jobs with the assisance of someone younger.

My ex-business partner had to get a helper just because he had trouble driving in the city and he wasn't that old. The stress was just to much for him.

 

[brian john]

Say you have an employee who is... oh, 73 years 2 months and 14 days old. :smile:
Does not complain about the symptoms of old age and shows up every day... BUT, this person is not flexible.

I had a guy like this once drove my bonkers as a vast majority of our work is emergency and requires moving form job to job. In addition he was a complainer. He made it easy I caught him cutting up and stripping copper on a job.

 

[peter d]

Peter. There is a LOT more top being a boss than simply being a strong authority figure. In a black and white world with an unlimited and equal labor supply, a bosses job would be easy. Just fire #25146 and #25147 would step right in.

Being a small contractor requires the OWNERS to be the flexible ones. We have to look at the strengths and weaknesses of all the people that work for us and determine how to best utilize them.

You are not going to get perfection. If he was perfect, he wouldn't be working for you.

If he is 73 and still earning money, there is no problem. You KNOW is capabilities and his limitations. Use that info and build a solid working relationship. Don't ruin the last few years of the old guy's life by trying to change him. Sit down and tell him how glad you are to have him working with you.

Uh huh. I still don't think Marc having to walk on eggshells to talk to his own employee is a good thing, and I stand by that. I also can see the predicament Marc is in because this guy sounds like a good worker.

 

[Karl H]

Firing a man that's not accountable is easy.Firing a man for stealing
is easier.Confronting a good man is difficult and usually more
positive than negative.

 

[ceb58]

The guy is 73 years old. He still wants to be productive. I have seen people that retire and do nothing and they are dead in a few years.
The next time he starts complaining just tell him in a light hearted way " look you old fart, I need you to do this and quit whining like a little girl"
His complaining is nothing more than wanting/needing some attention. We do not know what this guy faces when he goes home at the end of the day. I personally hope that when I am 73 I am still out there aggravating the crap out of some one like Marc.:grin:

 

[Power Tech]

Uh huh. I still don't think Marc having to walk on eggshells to talk to his own employee is a good thing, and I stand by that. I also can see the predicament Marc is in because this guy sounds like a good worker.

I once had a dog that I did not like. I got another dog and then first dog looked realy good.

 

[Karl H]

I personally hope that when I am 73 I am still out there aggravating the crap out of some one like Marc.

Now that's funny!

 

[boboelectric]

You're the Boss?Have a cup of coffee and talk it over.

 

[cadpoint]

Yes, it's becoming clear that this might be the resolution. or, at a minimum, I need to do it. I'm not ashamed, frankly, to admit that I'm a bit intimidated to have such a talk with a man that's older than my dad. I can do it, but it's going to be one of the most uncomfortable things I've had to do in a very long time.

Positive reinforcement, I really like that one too! But sit sounds like your flipping a coin already!

Remind him what year this is, remind him how long he's been with you, or whatever left that matters to him!
I would have the man to man with him, with nothing left un-said!
Based on how he responds, featuring either the BOO look, SAD eyes, or anger!

Any of those responses I would proceed to have then officially put Him on Notice, and explain to him why this is the First and Last Time. That you'll over putting up with it. That as a man he should not be compaining as to the nature of the work, Period. You can point out your postion, what his position is, what is required by having a position with-in your company!

I would be concerned about an age discrimination law suit if you fire him.
Mike

He was given Notice!

Peter. There is a LOT more top being a boss than simply being a strong authority figure. In a black and white world with an unlimited and equal labor supply, a bosses job would be easy. Just fire #25146 and #25147 would step right in.

Being a small contractor requires the OWNERS to be the flexible ones. We have to look at the strengths and weaknesses of all the people that work for us and determine how to best utilize them.

You are not going to get perfection. If he was perfect, he wouldn't be working for you.

If he is 73 and still earning money, there is no problem. You KNOW is capabilities and his limitations. Use that info and build a solid working relationship. Don't ruin the last few years of the old guy's life by trying to change him. Sit down and tell him how glad you are to have him working with you.

Other fine points that you could use as you give notice.

I'm not much for conversations at work, I hate talking a job to death, it's just work, lets go, we ain't left yet!

 

[Pierre C Belarge]

Fire him for no reason, and he gets unemployment. Have good cause, and he's doesn't.

Besides, that won't prevent him from at least suing you, cause or not. CYA by documenting what you did prior to termination (if that's the route you're taking). Once his legal eagles know your side of story, they'll realize there's no payday in it for them.

I cannot speak for the labor laws outside of NY, but what you mention above would not be true in NY.
Firing for any reason will still lead to unemployment payments. It just may delay them for a couple of weeks.

Firing an employee today is not like it was just 10 years ago. Employees have many more venues to collect in some way, than in the past.

 

[ichimo23]

I had to laugh when i read this post, as we have the exact situation at the company where i work. I would even say it's a bit worse where we are, as the geezer thinks he has the 'right of refusal' on any task. He exercises this right at least a couple of times a week. When enough people complained to the boss (about 25 years younger than the geezer), he finally took some action. The next time he acted up, the boss just said "well, it looks like you need to take the rest of the day off. See you tomorrow" That usually cures the situation for a least a few weeks.

 

[alfiesauce]

My boss deals with this on a daily basis as well. The guy he deals with is his father in law.
They both get on each others nerves something horrible some days... But... The old man knows some great tricks to get a guy out of a bind.
Just make sure you don't start thinking about ways to knock the guy off.

 

[Kdog76]

Say you have an employee who is... oh, 73 years 2 months and 14 days old. :smile:

This man is an excellent craftsman, and fairly productive. Does not complain about the symptoms of old age and shows up every day... BUT, this person is not flexible. This person thrives on a daily routine, which is good for construction work. Any deviation from a daily routine makes this person miserable, and he'll make anyone that will listen to him miserable.

What do you do? Just deal with it, and struggle to keep him doing the routine and predictable work OR fire him and take pot luck with another candidate OR counsel him?

Routine? Ha! Without OVERDOING it I'd keep the old guy going from job to job with me for a few days...You could say something like "When we can stay on a job, great, but we HAVE to get caught up with these other service calls here, and we got to prioritize our good customers first." My last employer would tell me " You got to take care of your bread & butter accounts."
Give him a heads up first... Let him know in advance " Hey, these next couple weeks are going to keep us moving around a lot, no way we can stay on this one all the time" Keep him focused on the WORK. The WORK is the only routine, not a particular job. He starts to complain, you just keep him focused on the WORK that wherever it is, whenever it is. And you can try to make it a little fun for the old guy. Take him out for lunch or a coffee break, and turn around his complaining to stay focused on the WORK.

 

[electricmanscott]

I didn't read all the replies but somebody PLEASE kill me if I am still doing this crap at 73. Come to think of it 63 would be better.

 

[cadpoint]

I didn't read all the replies but somebody PLEASE kill me if I am still doing this crap at 73. Come to think of it 63 would be better.

Come on Man, your the lead man for "eat up with it" we're all following you...