Grounding and a Mulberry cover

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texie said:
250.146(A) seems pretty clear, no? UL White Book says this is covered by EOYX, QCIT, RTRT, and WJQR.
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Also, I might add that the last sentence of 250.146(A) was added in the 2008 NEC. This seems to make clear that this is an acceptable grounding means.
 
HackElectric said:
So to bring this back to the topic, I don't buy into the whole running of a copper EGC thing. The only reason a mulberry cover is going to come loose is because it was installed wrong, which I (or my employee) isn't going to do. If we were in the habit of installing cover plates incorrectly, then we could also install copper EGC's incorrectly, whether it be at the device screw, at the box screw, or at the wirenut splice.

So barring whether it makes you feel better, is there a definitive answer on whether it is code compliant to not run a copper AGC to the device in the situation described? What George Stolz posted seems to say that it goes both ways.
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I wasn't meaning to imply that anyone would deliberately do a shoddy install. However, it seems you've probably never worked in a production carpentry shop or in the backstage areas of a theater, where the receptacles work loose from the covers, and covers from boxes, simply from use (and occasional abuse). I've often seen and repaired loose receptacles and covers; there may or may not be a good path to ground across a loose receptacle or cover, so that's why I'm in favor of placing a ground jumper. That extra 30sec of work is cheap insurance.

As for what's code, I believe that dimpled-corner covers are compliant without the use of a grounding jumper; you'd have to check their listing and installation instructions. Code is a minimum, and in this case, one I'm happy to exceed. Oh, and our local AHJ likes to see the grounding jumpers, so there's that. :)


SceneryDriver
 
SceneryDriver said:
I wasn't meaning to imply that anyone would deliberately do a shoddy install. However, it seems you've probably never worked in a production carpentry shop or in the backstage areas of a theater, where the receptacles work loose from the covers, and covers from boxes, simply from use (and occasional abuse). I've often seen and repaired loose receptacles and covers; there may or may not be a good path to ground across a loose receptacle or cover, so that's why I'm in favor of placing a ground jumper. That extra 30sec of work is cheap insurance.

As for what's code, I believe that dimpled-corner covers are compliant without the use of a grounding jumper; you'd have to check their listing and installation instructions. Code is a minimum, and in this case, one I'm happy to exceed. Oh, and our local AHJ likes to see the grounding jumpers, so there's that. :)


SceneryDriver
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Again, I'm glad it makes you feel better, but your feelings really have no value. I don't know how many times you need to be told.
 
SceneryDriver said:
Required by code or not, I think a grounding jumper is a good idea and I always install one. How many receptacles have you seen that end up loose on the cover? How many times have you seen a loose cover? Maintaining ground continuity is always a good idea.


SceneryDriver
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I've never seen a loose device where it was bolted to the cover. However, I have seen many loose devices where they were merely attached with a plate screw, without a nut on the back side. The old covers that were attached with a single plate screw would come loose quite easily.
 
I'm perfectly fine omitting the EGC connection to a device on a raised cover. If it's that much of a concern, just tighten the mounting screws a few extra turns.
 
kbsparky said:
I've never seen a loose device where it was bolted to the cover. However, I have seen many loose devices where they were merely attached with a plate screw, without a nut on the back side. The old covers that were attached with a single plate screw would come loose quite easily.
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Using a captive nut or reaching into the box through a KO to hold the nut? I am not sure I can visualize what you are describing.

The type of cover shown in the picture does not allow you to use slots and pre-insert the screw.
 
GoldDigger said:
Using a captive nut or reaching into the box through a KO to hold the nut? I am not sure I can visualize what you are describing.

The type of cover shown in the picture does not allow you to use slots and pre-insert the screw.
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The cover shown in the OP is for a decora/GFCI.

kbsparky was talking about a cover for a duplex receptacle. The current ones require a pair of nuts and bolts to hold the receptacle, which is very strong and doesn't commonly loosen.

The old design, which is no longer allowed, only had 1 screw hole in the middle. You would push the screw thru the cover plate and tighten it into the receptacle hole like a normal cover plate, that was the only thing holding the receptacle to the cover and it was know to loosen over time.
 
peter d said:
I'm perfectly fine omitting the EGC connection to a device on a raised cover. If it's that much of a concern, just tighten the mounting screws a few extra turns.
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Well if it is possible to tighten it even one extra turn without overdoing it and breaking the screw, it probably wasn't very tight at all to begin with:happyyes:
 
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