inspectors

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Yes, your absolutely right. It is very hard to fail a Commercial\Industrial project.
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I hope there is some sarcasm in this statement, I make a living correcting problems with commercial/industrial projects.
 
I have three rules. 1) I'm gonna sign the card sooner or later 2) It's much easier to sign the card than to write a correction notice 3) Once I start writing a correction notice, I write everything.

I have no idea what my pass/fail rate is as I don't keep track of such things. It's not a game or a contest it's simply you do the job right you pass and if you don't, you don't. If the EC is on the job it is usually much easier to pass an inspection as the simple things can be fixed right then and there. If he's not there then it becomes hit and miss. A KO seal missing well I would really like that fixed, a couple of staples missing I can live with that. The panels not labeled, well I can see how that could happen. You get the idea. Now if I find all of these things on one job, a notice get's written.

I once passed a house at rough that was missing about 4 required outlets. The guy says, "I'll have them in this afternoon and you can come back tomorrow and look". I said "I don't need to come back tomorrow and look, put them in now or put them in at final, it's up to you. I think now would be easier."

I've done large projects such as grocery stores and never written a notice, I've also done A/C change outs and written two pages.

I pride myself on being able to understand and be understanding, but I have talked to inspectors that pride them selfs on always leaving a correction notice.
 
Fire Alarm said:
I've been reading on this forum about how often Inspectors write corrections, but what is the rate that Inspectors are wrong?

The second reason to learn the NEC is to do safe electrical installations, but the VERY FIRST REASON to study the NEC is to protect yourself from Inspectors.

I am aware of very fine Inspectors both on this forum and in the workplace, please be confident that my criticisms do not apply to you.

Some of the stupidest things I have ever heard have dribbled out of the mouths of Inspectors. Last week I had an Inspector inform me it was "Illegal" to install 15 amp circuits in any structure. (we have no such local ordinance).

Some of the zaniest, most ridiculous statements have come from inspectors. Often when they blurt out their nonsense, I confront them with the code and they say "OK, I'll let you slide on this one...".

Homeowners never believe the EC is correct, their love of authority tells them that the Inspector is always right and the EC is trying to pull a fast one. When an Inspector shoots down a job for no reason, he has done irreparable damage to the relationship betweem the HO and EC.

Also, when talking about rejection rates from the Inspectors point of view, the average Inspector looks at a lot of DIY type jobs that take several inspections just to become code compliant.

I talked to an Inspector a little while ago and he said that about 75% of the remodels he inspects, were done by the home owner. That fact alone should show that rejections delivered to licensed contractors are not nearly as bad as the over all rate would suggest.

Moral of the story: You must study the code to protect yourself from those who don't.
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The thing is FA when we get into these kinds of discussions is that it is always a two way street. Inspectors, give me an amen if you've heard any of these before:

"I've been doing this for thirty years"
"You're the only "jurisdiction" that calls that"
"I've never heard of such a thing"
"I've always done it like this and never been called on it before"
"I just did a job over in _____ and they didn't make me do that"

Like James Grarner said in the movie Support Your Local Sheriff...."When you talk like that it just makes me tired all over. it's bad enough having kill a man, without having to listen to a bunch of stupid talk"

If you have one job and you have one inspector that's all you have to deal with good or bad. Now take some of these guys that are doing 20-30 inspections a day, imagine if 20 or 30 inspectors stopped by your job and you had to deal with each different pesonality and quality. Most of you will never meet 30 different inspectors. So yes, you get the one that's not well trained and he's gonna leave a mark.

I will tell you that our jurisdiction spends thousands of dollars on training for our inspectors and I will tell you that there are very few contractors attending these trainings. So yes I do agree that training is very important.

Like I told someone in another post. Your job is to know the code, my job is to simply verify that you did yours. :smile:
 
cowboyjwc said:
The thing is FA when we get into these kinds of discussions is that it is always a two way street. Inspectors, give me an amen if you've heard any of these before:

"I've been doing this for thirty years"
"You're the only "jurisdiction" that calls that"
"I've never heard of such a thing"
"I've always done it like this and never been called on it before"
"I just did a job over in _____ and they didn't make me do that"

Like James Grarner said in the movie Support Your Local Sheriff...."When you talk like that it just makes me tired all over. it's bad enough having kill a man, without having to listen to a bunch of stupid talk"

If you have one job and you have one inspector that's all you have to deal with good or bad. Now take some of these guys that are doing 20-30 inspections a day, imagine if 20 or 30 inspectors stopped by your job and you had to deal with each different pesonality and quality. Most of you will never meet 30 different inspectors. So yes, you get the one that's not well trained and he's gonna leave a mark.

I will tell you that our jurisdiction spends thousands of dollars on training for our inspectors and I will tell you that there are very few contractors attending these trainings. So yes I do agree that training is very important.

Like I told someone in another post. Your job is to know the code, my job is to simply verify that you did yours. :smile:
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Extremely well put. Very reasonable. I'd have to disagree with "Most of you will never meet 30 different inspectors" however, I'm sure the average EC has certainly met over 100 inspectors. It's good to get a peek at what you guys must deal with.
 
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Fire Alarm said:
Extremely well put. Very reasonable. I'd have to disagree with "Most of you will never meet 30 different inspectors" however, I'm sure the average EC has certainly met over 100 inspectors. It's good to get a peek at what you guys must deal with.
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You may be right, so I'll retract the number of inspectors you guys meet. I think in my head that I was thinking of the local guys who tend to stay close to home so they deal with the same inspectors all the time.

I guess that if I'm dealing with a bunch of different contractors, they must be coming from somewhere.:smile:
 
i got my registration in 1978, had only one red tag, it was on my first job, i was not there with the inspector......now i am always there when an inspector is there and if i think i think it will help the job, i'll meet with him before starting and get his input......i tell them.... "Now you are the Priest and the NEC code is the Bible, explain to me what it says about this job".......i have found that this statement goes a long way with an inspector..........
 
Ernest Schwarz said:
i got my registration in 1978, had only one red tag, it was on my first job, i was not there with the inspector......now i am always there when an inspector is there and if i think i think it will help the job, i'll meet with him before starting and get his input......i tell them.... "Now you are the Priest and the NEC code is the Bible, explain to me what it says about this job".......i have found that this statement goes a long way with an inspector..........
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Meeting with your inspector before hand is a great way to start a job. We have, what we call a precon, meeting before each project. We get an idea of what your schedule is and we tell you what we expect and how the process is going to work. We get to meet the contractors and they get to ask any questions that they might have and get our cards so that they can call before they run into a problem.

Depending on the contractor, we've been less than three weeks into a large project and you'd think that we'd never talked.:smile:
 
Ernest Schwarz said:
i got my registration in 1978, had only one red tag, it was on my first job, i was not there with the inspector......now i am always there when an inspector is there and if i think i think it will help the job, i'll meet with him before starting and get his input......i tell them.... "Now you are the Priest and the NEC code is the Bible, explain to me what it says about this job".......i have found that this statement goes a long way with an inspector..........
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I hear stories like this sometimes. A guy says he hasn't failed an inspection in 30 years. It's hard to believe. I'm not saying you're being untruthful, if you say so, I believe you.

Here in Los Angeles I probably fail an inspection once or twice a month. Usually for some chicken-s thing not in the code book or some other moronic reason. Safety plates protecting Romex is a common one. If the edge of a bored hole is not within 1.25" of the face of the stud, it doesn't need a plate. But Inspectors seldom know this bit of trivia.

In the big city, failed inspections just come with the turf. I don't kick up a fuss, I know the Inspector has a psychological reason he needed to shoot me down, so if it's not a big deal, I just do what he asks and move on.

In Los Angeles, the LADBS has created an adversarial system, it's "them" vs "us". The truly laughable part is how little of the job actually gets inspected. Don't tell me what a heroic defender of building codes you are if you won't enter the crawl space or climb through the attic.

Getting shot down is a common place occurrence and has nothing to do with the quality of your work.
 
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Fire Alarm said:
I hear stories like this sometimes. A guy says he hasn't failed an inspection in 30 years. It's hard to believe. I'm not saying you're being untruthful, if you say so, I believe you.

Here in Los Angeles I probably fail an inspection once or twice a month. Usually for some chicken-s thing not in the code book or some other moronic reason. Safety plates protecting Romex is a common one. If the edge of a bored hole is not within 1.25" of the face of the stud, it doesn't need a plate. But Inspectors seldom know this bit of trivia.

In the big city, failed inspections just come with the turf. I don't kick up a fuss, I know the Inspector has a psychological reason he needed to shoot me down, so if it's not a big deal, I just do what he asks and move on.

In Los Angeles, the LADBS has created an adversarial system, it's "them" vs "us". The truly laughable part is how little of the job actually gets inspected. Don't tell me what a heroic defender of building codes you are if you won't enter the crawl space or climb through the attic.

Getting shot down is a common place occurrence and has nothing to do with the quality of your work.
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I don't have a psychological reason to shoot you down I just do it because I can.:grin: Really really only kidding.

LA has had that reputation for years and will probably never live it down. I had been an inspector for five years when I got wrote up on a couple of bogus calls in the Kingdom of LA while helping a friend with a room addition.

I do know in some jurisdictions the inspectors that don't write notices are treated like cops that don't write speeding tickets. They must not be doing their job.

Here, which is just a border line away from LA, we get a lot of leway. Sign the job card or leave a notice, they don't care which.

I wonder sometimes if a bunch of inspectors are sitting in an office at the end of the month looking at a big board. "OK the winner this month is Bob, he had a contactor move all of his straps a half inch down and second place goes to Ed who had the contractor pull out his ground rod so that Ed could verify that it was 8' long":grin:
 
what i do.....

what i do.....

since my second job, i have always met the inspector for an inspection......and have never received a red flag since.......yes, i got one on my first job....simple correction........and it was passed.......

now i always meet with the inspector if there is anything i think he may want a say on or about......and i always use the same statement...... "You are the Priest and the code book is the Bible, now tell me what it says" .........they love that statement and i have had good relationship with the inspectors........

just my way of doing things that seems to work for me........

when the electrician came home late, his wife asked "wire are you insulate?"......
 
Entering house through back of meter? In the State I work in and the 4 surrounding ones it is illegal to punch out the back of meter base under any circumstances.
 
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