OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

[electricaldoc]

I have been searching with no luck. Is NFPA 70E enforced by OSHA? If not is any PPE required by OSHA? My work has big debate going on about this, and everyone has their own opinion. Unfortunately no one has hard facts. Was told in my training that it was as of 2004, but I can not find any proof. Also I was told we must were all PPE until circuit is confirmed dead. Is this true?

If NFPA 70E not enforced by OSHA, than were can I find OSHA requirements?

Any help appreciated
Thanks to all
Dan

 

[iwire]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

I just searched the OSHA website and found this OSHA interpretation.

NFPA 70E electrical safety requirements and personal protective equipment.

Question (2): I note that OSHA has not incorporated the personal protective equipment portions of NFPA 70E by reference in ?1910.132 (personal protective equipment, general requirements) or ?1910.335 (safeguards for personal protection). Does an employer have an obligation under the General Duty Clause to ensure that its own employees comply with personal protective equipment requirements in NFPA 70E?

Answer
These provisions are written in general terms, requiring, for example, that personal protective equipment be provided "where necessary by reason of hazards..." (?1910.132(a)), and requiring the employer to select equipment "that will protect the affected employee from the hazards...." (?1910.132(d)(1)). Also, ?1910.132(c) requires the equipment to "be of safe design and construction for the work performed."

Similarly, ?1910.335 contains requirements such as the provision and use of "electrical protective equipment that is appropriate for the specific parts of the body to be protected and the work to be performed (?1910.335(a)(i)).

Industry consensus standards, such as NFPA 70E, can be used by employers as guides to making the assessments and equipment selections required by the standard. Similarly, in OSHA enforcement actions, they can be used as evidence of whether the employer acted reasonably.

Under ?1910.135, the employer must ensure that affected employees wear a protective helmet that meets either the applicable ANSI Z89.1 standard or a helmet that the employer demonstrates "to be equally effective." If an employer demonstrated that NFPA 70E contains criteria for protective helmets regarding protection against falling objects and electrical shock that is equal to or more stringent than the applicable ANSI Z89.1 standard, and a helmet met the NFPA 70E criteria, the employer could use that to demonstrate that the helmet is "equally effective."

The way I read it OSHA does not have to adopt 70E to use it against you. :roll:

[ June 18, 2005, 05:04 PM: Message edited by: iwire ]

 

[H.L.]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

Originally posted by H.L.:

Originally posted by electricaldoc:
I have been searching with no luck. Is NFPA 70E enforced by OSHA? If not is any PPE required by OSHA? My work has big debate going on about this, and everyone has their own opinion. Unfortunately no one has hard facts. Was told in my training that it was as of 2004, but I can not find any proof. Also I was told we must were all PPE until circuit is confirmed dead. Is this true?

If NFPA 70E not enforced by OSHA, than were can I find OSHA requirements?

Any help appreciated
Thanks to all
Dan

OSHA does include NFPA70E by reference. See 29CFR1910 Subpart S Appendix A. For a difivative answer submit your question to OSHA and request a letter of interpretation. Another excellent reference is the Construction Safety Council 800-552-7744

 

[petersonra]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

The way I read it OSHA does not have to adopt 70E to use it against you. :roll:


In case you have yet to figure it out, OSHA can use anything they want against you, regardless of whether they adopt it or not.

And in fact, if they adopt a code, they can still attack you even if you are in compliance.

[ June 19, 2005, 11:33 AM: Message edited by: petersonra ]

 

[tom baker]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

If you have a copy of 70E, read the introduction. It states basically that OSHA has all the electrical safety rules in 70E, and uses those rules as 70E is kept current by a committee.

 

[H.L.]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

Originally posted by petersonra:
The way I read it OSHA does not have to adopt 70E to use it against you. :roll:


In case you have yet to figure it out, OSHA can use anything they want against you, regardless of whether they adopt it or not.

And in fact, if they adopt a code, they can still attack you even if you are in compliance.

Keep in mind that even if OSHA does cite you, you have the right to appeal and that the fines generally are lowered on appeal.

 

[electricaldoc]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

I guess the question pertains more to the fact that our employer is saying. That NFPA 70E is OSHA REGULATION, and there for we must follow it to a ?T?. I have no problem with this, and thought the instructor I had said it was. However most electricians do not want to wear this PPE, and argue if not OSHA regulation then is just a suggestion, and there for not enforceable.

This is way I need to find proof.
Thanks again for help.
Dan

 

[Nick]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

See some of the discussions Here

 

[H.L.]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

Originally posted by electricaldoc:
I guess the question pertains more to the fact that our employer is saying. That NFPA 70E is OSHA REGULATION, and there for we must follow it to a ?T?. I have no problem with this, and thought the instructor I had said it was. However most electricians do not want to wear this PPE, and argue if not OSHA regulation then is just a suggestion, and there for not enforceable.

This is way I need to find proof.
Thanks again for help.
Dan

If it is company policy and it is more stringent than OSHA then OSHA can cite it. Especially if the company policy is written. ie., Osha says that hardhats must be worn when a hazard exists. If your company policy says that you shall wear your hardhat at all times on the jobsite then OSHA can cite you for not wearing it even when working in a finished space open to the public where no hazard exists.
H.L.

 

[zog]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

Not all of the 70E PPE requirements are from OSHA, in fact OSHA currently has very few references to arc flash protection in the standard. OSHA is working on a new revision (Subpart V) that will encompass most of the 2004 70E. Until then , OSHA requires that you follow industry standards when not referenced by OSHA, the 70E is considered the industry standard and can (And had on many occassions) be submitted in court.

 

[kevinsarnold]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

Keep in mind, OSHA does require PPE as does 70E while exposed to energized electrical equipment until the equipment is placed in "an electrically safe work condition". OSHA references shock and arc-flash as well as any other related dangers such as arc-blast (physical forces such as shrapnel, pressure, etc.). PPE is only designed to protect against the thermal effects, not necessarily the physical forces. OSHA has their own requirements and clauses to where they don't have to adopt 70E. However, there is a video out there that interviews David Wallace from OSHA (I believe his title is Director of Electrical Safety) and he states the importance of 70E and how he would "personally" follow it.

 

[rbalex]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

In the general order of things FedOSHA rules begin with the assumption that an worker accident CANNOT be the worker?s fault; either the working conditions were inherently unsafe or the worker was not trained properly to work within the conditions.

In other words, where an employer/employee relationship can be established, the employer is always at fault unless they can prove the employee was deliberately trying to get injured. Even if a worker ignores clearly posted safety warnings, it is only evidence of inadequate training. The best an employer can do is to reduce their liability by showing they made reasonable efforts to create a safe working environment and requiring appropriate training.

Under Section 29CFR1910.1(a) (the general use clause) FedOSHA is permitted to enforce any ?National Consensus Standard? [which in 29CFR1910.2 ]

?means any standard or modification thereof which (1) has been adopted and promulgated by a nationally recognized standards-producing organization under procedures whereby it can be determined by the Secretary of Labor or by the Assistant Secretary of Labor that persons interested and affected by the scope or provisions of the standard have reached substantial agreement on its adoption, (2) was formulated in a manner which afforded an opportunity for diverse views to be considered, and (3) has been designated as such a standard by the Secretary or the Assistant Secretary, after consultation with other appropriate Federal agencies?

NFPA 70E is such a standard.

MANY FedOSHA 29CFR1910 and 1926 Annexes are ?Non-Mandatory? recommendations; however failure to follow them is presumptive evidence of failure to comply with ?Regulations.?

So, while your electricians may believe it?s ??not OSHA regulation then is just a suggestion, and there for [sic] not enforceable,? on them, it IS ultimately enforceable on your employer.

 

[realolman]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

I'm sure to get blasted by several of the folks in this forum before I get it by arc flash.

I have been involved with electricity for 32 years including "hot" high voltage distribution, industrial feeders; and more recently, plant maintenence. I feel my experience validates my opinion to some extent, and in fact, I ain't dead yet.

I have no doubt of the considerable energy released by an arc flash incident,and there are situations that undoubtedly require PPE. But I am very much opposed to a blanket policy requiring PPE in troubleshooting.

Of course I have no statistics, but I think that the number of times a volt or amp reading is taken, or a PLC program or output checked without incident, puts the odds of being injured by an arc flash in the same ballpark as being hit by lightning or winning the lottery, and I don't want to wear PPE in anticipation of either of those events either. It's too hot out there and I don't need any additional clumsiness and aggravation introduced by PPE. ( yes, I'm sure the arc flash is much hotter... I've seen the "training films", please spare me. )

Are there any OSHA,NFPA,or NEC standards regarding the providing and maintenance of blueprints, drawings, and other documentation? I think that would be the biggest step possible in promoting industrial electrical safety. A person often wouldn't even have to go in the same room as the equipment to troubleshoot if appropriate documentation were maintained. Moreover, the problem often wouldn't even exist in the first place.

Does OSHA, NFPA, or NEC list specifics for being "qualified"?

In 32 years, I have never caused an arc. This is supposed to be a skilled profession. But unskilled people in moon suits are cheaper than skilled people and documentation aren't they?

We got all kinds of people coming around wanting to sell stickers to put on cabinets informing people like me that there is an arc flash hazard ( like I didn't know ).

Google "arc flash protection" and see what you get. People wanting to sell stuff. That's what this is all about... De-skilling workers, limiting liability, and selling fuses, stickers and survey services.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

or a PLC program or output checked without incident,

Arc flash protection is not required to work on circuits that cannot produce a hazardous arc flash. PLC I/O would be a circuit of that type. Voltage protection would still be required if the voltage is above 50 volts. Also, you sometimes have no control of the hazard. I am aware of a number of cases where the previous electrician had left tools or loose parts within the enclosure and when the trouble shooter removed the cover to do the testing, that loose part or tool fell into the bus causing serious injury or death. Remember, it is a rare case where the OSHA rules permit working on or near an energized circuit. The use of the correct PPE for this work is not an unreasonable requirement.
Don

 

[wpaul29]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

I find it hard to believe that you have never caused an arc in 32 years. Haven't you ever made a hot splice an seen arcing? Just because your not dead yet doesnt mean you don't need PPE! If PPE causes more of a hazard to work on something all you have to do is use common sense. I myself wish more people took electrical safety more serious. Most electricians I come in contact with have never heard of the NFPA 70E. The people who don't use PPE make others look bad because some higher upper always ask the question well he did it without gloves, glasses or something else why cant you? You see what I mean. This would be a much safer industry if the apprenticeships started teaching more about safety from the begining and if Osha could do a better job of enforcing the issues that really count. They will harp on you about safety glasses and a hard hat but if a job site is not properly lighted nothing is wrong. These are the kind of things I'm talking about and the more people ignore safety the worse it is for all of us.

At my current job I was actually thinking about leaving the industry for good because every company I went to was a joke on safety. I got to thinking that if this is the way its going to be why risk my self and my families welfare for it. In the end though things have gotten some what better although I still find myself having to do things that I know is not the safest way but I will still refuse things that I know pose a great danger.

 

[wirenut1980]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

In the general order of things FedOSHA rules begin with the assumption that an worker accident CANNOT be the worker?s fault; either the working conditions were inherently unsafe or the worker was not trained properly to work within the conditions.

It comes down to a person working on something that they are unqualified to work on. If the employer tells this unqualified person to even touch electrical equipment, then the employer is at fault, but if the worker is trying to be a hero and do it themselves, can the employer really be at fault? I would like to think not, but these days...

 

[realolman]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

What I meant was I never unexpectedly caused an arc flash incident that had the potential for injury. I do not consider myself to be a cowboy and do not take what I consider to be unreasonable chances. I have 32 years without an accident or a smoked screwdriver, have done some very nice work, and I am proud of that. I am also not stupid enough to make a statement like that without thanking God, or realizing that tomorrow could change all that.

I think taking volt readings, checking the states of relays and such in a troubleshooting effort without PPE is not unreasonable. Most PLCs that I have seen are in the same enclosure as the motor starters and what not. Undoubtedly these arc flash regs will alter engineering for increased isolation of serious hazards, and in that vein I am all for it.

What I was getting at in my earlier post re: being "qualified" was the blanket forcing of skilled people to wear PPE in low hazard tasks without regard to their personal discomfort or abilities. That is "de-skilling" and results in lower pay rates so that idiots can leave wrenches in the tops of energized electrical enclosures, when they should be bagging groceries. This is work for knowledgeable people.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

Dave,

One other thing, if proper lockout-tagout procedures are followed, PPE is not required if the circuit is de-energized.

The lockout is not complete until you prove that the parts to be worked on are de-energized, and you need PPE to use your meter to prove that the circuit is locked out.
Don

 

[wirenut1980]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

realolman, I never meant to imply that you were unqualified for any job you do. I apologize if that is the way my post came off. In fact, you can be the most qualified person working on a job and something can still go wrong, even if you think you are being completely safe. But the best way, IMO, to avoid permanent injury or scarring or death is to follow NFPA 70E procedures, which involves wearing the proper PPE. And for a lot of instances that could mean just wearing a pair of gloves with rubber insulation for shock protection and leather exterior or similar to prevent 2nd or 3rd degree burns. The instructor in an electrical safety class I was in really stressed the protection of hands among other things, because "your hands are your craft, and if you lose the use of those, you cannot do your job anymore."

Dave,

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
One other thing, if proper lockout-tagout procedures are followed, PPE is not required if the circuit is de-energized.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The lockout is not complete until you prove that the parts to be worked on are de-energized, and you need PPE to use your meter to prove that the circuit is locked out.
Don

Absolutely!

 

[rbalex]

Re: OSHA enforces NFPA70E?

Originally posted by wirenut1980:
...If the employer tells this unqualified person to even touch electrical equipment, then the employer is at fault, but if the worker is trying to be a hero and do it themselves, can the employer really be at fault?...

Absolutely they can be - and will be. This would be a prime example of a lack of proper employee training in FedOSHA's view.