photos from my first plastic & wirenut job!

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WOW all I can say is ; I've always wanted to see the legends do their soldering magic.If anyone has the balls to call me a Young Gun at 40 and 22 years in the trade. I will respectfully sit Indian Style with open ears and with an open mind for hours.Teach on SIR!!!!!!!
 
480sparky said:
I hope you have the box properly grounded......
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The ground wire gets clipped to the box. I just didn't show it in my picture.

Karl H said:
WOW all I can say is ; I've always wanted to see the legends do their soldering magic.If anyone has the balls to call me a Young Gun at 40 and 22 years in the trade. I will respectfully sit Indian Style with open ears and with an open mind for hours.Teach on SIR!!!!!!!
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I guess that was a compliment to me? I appreciate it. I haven't been doing this work nearly as long as you, being I'm 25, but the man I apprenticed under has been in the trade 49 years now so I was taught "old school." But you guys are bringing me up to speed on how things are being done in the modern age. D:
 
I hate to rain on the party here but I have seen better soldering. One of the best reasons not to do it is it is difficult, time consuming, and often not done properly. Cleanlyness is next to Godlyness when it comes to soldering.It does not appear that the wires in these connections were cleaned ahead of time. Probably the solder and iron were not cleaned either resulting in the uneven flow in the joints pictured. It is hard to clean wires in J-boxes and for solder to flow properly you have to heat the conductors and the solder hot enough. The line between having enough heat for good flow and too much where you melt the insulation and contaminate the connection is fine indeed. Anyways welcome to the 21st century and the magic of plastic. Nice work!!:)
 
iaov said:
I hate to rain on the party here but I have seen better soldering.
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never said i was the best at it. i just do it the way i was taught by someone who's done it for almost 50 years. my feelings aren't hurt. i did like the plastic though.
 
brantmacga,

Tell'em how it was! And it worked good!

I've used steel boxes and dipped solder and burned my fingers taping them.

But that was back in 1969.
 
glene77is said:
brantmacga,

Tell'em how it was! And it worked good!

I've used steel boxes and dipped solder and burned my fingers taping them.

But that was back in 1969.
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i'm a believer! honestly if it weren't for some of criticism and sarcastic humor i got on here before about using steel & solder, i probably wouldn't have tried them. but, i believe this to be a group of people who know what they are doing, and decided to listen to people who've been doing this a lot longer than i have. the result paid off. so, thanks to you that made fun of me for helping me. :) i appreciate it.
 
brantmacga said:
:D :D yeh. my wife was pulling up the drive when i was taking the pictures.

her - "what are you doing?"

me - "nothing."

her - "doesn't look like nothing. is this for that stupid website?"
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I get the same crap every day. I think they have Mike Holt Envy. :wink: :smile:
 
Now that you've successfully experimented with plastic boxes and wirenuts, you should experiment with telephone wiring. In all modern houses, the phones are now inside! This could be a source of extra income!
green_acres.jpg
 
HaskinsElectric said:
Now that you've successfully experimented with plastic boxes and wirenuts, you should experiment with telephone wiring. In all modern houses, the phones are now inside! This could be a source of extra income!
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Let's not forget about indoor bathrooms as well! There is money to be made on the wiring in them!
 
brantmacga said:
yeh yeh :roll:

i'm pricing both ways now (steel & plastic) because some builders and homeowners won't have plastic in their houses.
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What do they think NM cable is made of -- steel????? It's plastic
 
i'll play along


HaskinsElectric said:
In all modern houses, the phones are now inside!
green_acres.jpg
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The heck you say!!



peter d said:
Let's not forget about indoor bathrooms as well! There is money to be made on the wiring in them!
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yes i've seen them inside, but just what kind of wiring does a hole in the floor need?

Dennis Alwon said:
What do they think NM cable is made of -- steel????? It's plastic
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I can't explain that one. Maybe they get lost in that fact looking at the shiny white, yellow, and orange colored cables.
 
iaov said:
I hate to rain on the party here but I have seen better soldering. One of the best reasons not to do it is it is difficult, time consuming, and often not done properly. Cleanlyness is next to Godlyness when it comes to soldering.It does not appear that the wires in these connections were cleaned ahead of time. Probably the solder and iron were not cleaned either resulting in the uneven flow in the joints pictured. It is hard to clean wires in J-boxes and for solder to flow properly you have to heat the conductors and the solder hot enough. The line between having enough heat for good flow and too much where you melt the insulation and contaminate the connection is fine indeed. Anyways welcome to the 21st century and the magic of plastic. Nice work!!:)
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Anyone who critizes the quality of those pictured solder connections does not his xxx from apple butter.

No contest here that a solder connection is a better, but a more time consuming connection than a wirenut.

I too, did not know that a soldered connection was legal for residential wiring.

And I have heard the term 'solder pot' used. How in the world would a person use a solder pot to complete any joints in residential?

Best Wishes Everyone
 
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Soldered connections can show a higher resistance then wire nut connections.

Don posted some info about this before, that said I am sure the connections in the picture will work fine for as long as they need to.
 
HighWirey said:
And I have heard the term 'solder pot' used. How in the world would a person use a solder pot to complete any joints in residential?
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My term of 'solder pot' may be inaccurate, but is meant to describe a metal 'spoon' in which a large amount of solder is melted.

In the method I have seen used, the electrician starts to heat up the solder before making up the boxes. While the solder is melting, he goes around and makes up the boxes, and turns all the connections downward. Imagine making a box up, as if intending to use wire nuts, but solder & tape instead.

Then, when all the make-up is done, the solder is melted. The electrician walks around the house and dips each set of twisted wires into the molten solder. Several connections can be done simultaniously if the 'pot' is large enough and prudent planning is done during make-up.

I would suspect this method is faster than using a coil of solder and a torch, buy you would still need to return (again) to each box to tape the joints and finish stuffing the boxes.
 
iwire said:
Soldered connections can show a higher resistance then wire nut connections.
Don posted some info about this before, that said I am sure the connections in the picture will work fine for as long as they need to.
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iwire,

Thanx for the reply. I missed Don's earlier reply. I am a newby.
How can a twisted and soldered connection have a lower resistance than a twisted only scotchlok connection? Rhetorical question here.

Thanks for your work as a moderator. How do you moderators find the time?

480,

I now remember hearing of the 'spoon' method of soldering.

Most of my exposure to splicing was with the old time 'paper insulated and lead' communication cable splicers. Twist and solder (with sterine flux and an electric iron) and a waxed cotton sleeve as the insulator. Yes, they were still using that old technology at the Kennedy Space Center 8 years ago.

Thank you for your response.

Best Wishes Everyone
 
I don't have the original source, but the premise was that the solder itself has a higher resistance than the copper to copper connection. In a correctly done solder joint the copper will be completely coated by the solder. The difference would be very small and would never make any difference in a real world connection.

A side note on dipped solder joints. My dad did all of the electrical in the house I grew up in. Everything was in rigid conduit and all of the joints were soldered using a dip pot. I was making a change for my mom a few years ago and found a box in the basement where the joints had been dipped, but never taped or tucked back into the box. Been that way for over 40 years.
 
don_resqcapt19 said:
I don't have the original source, but the premise was that the solder itself has a higher resistance than the copper to copper connection. In a correctly done solder joint the copper will be completely coated by the solder. The difference would be very small and would never make any difference in a real world connection.
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The solder itself is not the "joint" IMO - it is the splicing technique, the solder is just used to seal and hold it together....

110.14(B) Splices.
Conductors shall be spliced or joined with splicing devices identified for the use or by brazing, welding, or soldering with a fusible metal or alloy. Soldered splices shall first be spliced or joined so as to be mechanically and electrically secure without solder and then be soldered. All splices and joints and the free ends of conductors shall be covered with an insulation equivalent to that of the conductors or with an insulating device identified for the purpose.
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e57,
The solder itself is not the "joint" IMO - it is the splicing technique, the solder is just used to seal and hold it together....
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Yes, but there will be no exposed copper. The solder will coat the copper completely even when it has been tightly twisted.
 
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