piece work
- Thread starter pmiller
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mdshunk
Senior Member
- Location
- Right here.
Are you taking about being paid piece work as an employee, or charging by the item as a contractor? I'm a little bit fuzzy on the exact question you're asking.
ceb
Senior Member
- Location
- raeford,nc
Yes,I very good to you I pay you $2.00 to install switch. I charge customer $55.00. You make very much good money if you work fast.satcom said:
Oakey
Senior Member
- Location
- New Jersey
I applied for a job in Florida 3 yrs ago.I was told that piece work is the norm down there and it is basically as it sounds..$$ per outlet etc, strickly sub work.
e57
Senior Member
- Location
- San Francisco, CA
pmiller said:
Is there such an animal? Sounds lose - lose to me.... Rushed slapshod low baller work and custom punchlists don't mix IMO.
- Location
- Windsor, CO NEC: 2017
- Occupation
- Service Manager
I agree, "custom" and "piecework" should not appear in the same sentence, if the welfare of the customer or the employee are of any consequence.
You can piece out tract homes, but I'd advise against it. I've been there, and will always have hard feelings toward the employer in large part because of it.
You can piece out tract homes, but I'd advise against it. I've been there, and will always have hard feelings toward the employer in large part because of it.
peter d
Senior Member
- Location
- New England
I have never seen anything good come of piecework. It's non-existent in my area, at least in the electrical trade, but I have seen plenty of it (at least the result of it) in my travels to the western states. As George said, it seems to be a favorite of the tract home EC's, but I can't see it working any place but in that market.
mdshunk
Senior Member
- Location
- Right here.
Piecework exists in my area a little bit, but it's done a little differently. The EC has his piecework crew basically bid the print to him, and tell him what they'd need for the labor to complete that home's wiring. They're basically wiring for a flat fee. Doesn't matter if they work overtime or weekends, because the EC pays the same flat fee that they all agreed on ahead of time. I'd never do that to a man. I'm not even sure how it's legal, but that's on them.
charlie tuna
Senior Member
- Location
- Florida
"piecework" has been the downfall of many other trades. with our trade dependent upon the work being correctly installed (the first time) any contractor would be crazy to even entertain the thought of "piecework"!!!
whether you are pro piecework or con, as long as the man gets at least minimum wage in his paycheck and you pay all the proper payroll taxes, they are an employee, not a sub contractor.
you will cover their workers comp, benefits, FICA, SUTA, etc....
what many piecework companies do is convert the monies earned into an hourly rate, and pay taxes off that.
one other train of thought....when we as contractors bid a project, don't we typically place a dollar value (including labor) on every part of that project? so you can quite easily insititue a piecework rate.
George mentioned that he worked piecework and still has hard feelings for the contractor...I pose this question....if the piecework rate was too low, going hourly would probably have raised the labor rates....would the contractor have still gotten the contract?
Here is an article about a plumbing company in Arizona that has a system in place (you may need to register for free to view it)
Piecework, if run properly, could be a win-win....but in most cases it's not run properly, and it does become a lose-lose...
I will leave you with this thought....for everyone who is against piecework, because it will lead to cutting corners and shoddy work...
Do you ever give a hard bid on a job? Then, it can be said that you, the owner of the EC, will do shoddy work and cut corners because you are actually working piecework. You will only get $x for that project, no matter how long it takes.
Sorry, but anyone who will perform shoddy work and cut corners doing piecework, will do the same if they are working hourly. It's called lack of ethics and morals....and no matter how you pay them, they won't change their way of thinking...
you will cover their workers comp, benefits, FICA, SUTA, etc....
what many piecework companies do is convert the monies earned into an hourly rate, and pay taxes off that.
one other train of thought....when we as contractors bid a project, don't we typically place a dollar value (including labor) on every part of that project? so you can quite easily insititue a piecework rate.
George mentioned that he worked piecework and still has hard feelings for the contractor...I pose this question....if the piecework rate was too low, going hourly would probably have raised the labor rates....would the contractor have still gotten the contract?
Here is an article about a plumbing company in Arizona that has a system in place (you may need to register for free to view it)
Piecework, if run properly, could be a win-win....but in most cases it's not run properly, and it does become a lose-lose...
I will leave you with this thought....for everyone who is against piecework, because it will lead to cutting corners and shoddy work...
Do you ever give a hard bid on a job? Then, it can be said that you, the owner of the EC, will do shoddy work and cut corners because you are actually working piecework. You will only get $x for that project, no matter how long it takes.
Sorry, but anyone who will perform shoddy work and cut corners doing piecework, will do the same if they are working hourly. It's called lack of ethics and morals....and no matter how you pay them, they won't change their way of thinking...
piece work
Actually I am a contractor and have never used piece work before and we mostly do customs and semi customs...some electricians have approached me to piece out the work. So I was just seeing if anyone had done this before. I have too much work and these guys responded to the ad. Not trying to do shabby work, just trying to keep people happy with the work getting done and actually these guys do pretty clean work. So I want to compensate them and was just wondering if anyone had some pricing they used.
Actually I am a contractor and have never used piece work before and we mostly do customs and semi customs...some electricians have approached me to piece out the work. So I was just seeing if anyone had done this before. I have too much work and these guys responded to the ad. Not trying to do shabby work, just trying to keep people happy with the work getting done and actually these guys do pretty clean work. So I want to compensate them and was just wondering if anyone had some pricing they used.
andinator
Senior Member
- Location
- Lilburn Georgia
emahler is correct.. Although I'm back to being an hourly wage warrior I pieceworked homes (mainly nice "tract homes" by a nationwide builder) and also some custom. Although the hours were long and the pressure a bit intense sometimes I made a ton of money. Trimming out these homes would average 30$ an hour.. THats pretty good cash in ATL. THe housing market has softened here in GA and I've made the switch to commercial where the stress is less and the work is physically much easier.
mdshunk
Senior Member
- Location
- Right here.
I disagree with this notion, based on how I'd feel if it was me. I'm not ashamed to admit that if I was a piece rate employee I would consider cutting corners that I otherwise wouldn't cut if I was getting an hourly wage. By that same token, if I was on an hourly wage, I would also not think twice about going above and beyond, providing little extras to make things nicer that I'd otherwise not consider doing if I was on piece rate. In the middle there someplace can exist a system whereby the person receives a wage with a productivity incentive pay of some sort.emahler said:
mdshunk said:
I totally agree, IMO The way to productivity is, a system where the employee receives a wage, and a productivity incentive.
A good number of those paying piece work, are paying cash, and not reporting taxes, leaving the rest of us to carry their unpaid tax burden, also the piece worker looses protection if injured and any other benifits he may of had as an employee.
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LawnGuyLandSparky
Senior Member
andinator said:
$30.00 an hour is good cash in ATL? Are you looking at that from a contractor's perspective to cover expenses, taxes, and insurance, or are you looking at it from an employee's perspective, where $30.00 AN HOUR means $30.00 an hour PLUS bennies, worker's comp, pension, uniform, tools etc?
- Location
- Windsor, CO NEC: 2017
- Occupation
- Service Manager
Yes. The effort involved in their Rube Goldberg piecework experiment likely added cost (or decreased profit) to the bid.emahler said:
In general, I made more money on piecework - but they could have kept that money and saved me the effort and aggravation of trying to figure out if my check was right or not.
That aspect aside, the cheap GCs that were going for the lowest bid didn't fare too well with the slowdown, that I've noticed. $60,000 worth of I.O.U.'s doesn't contribute a dime to the payroll.
mdshunk said:
then I ask you this, as a contractor, do you do any fixed price jobs? do you cut corners?
someone has to pay for the "going above and beyond, providing little extras", it's either the customer or the contractor...if an employee is hourly, odds are it's the contractor that's paying for them...if the employee is piecework, odd's are no one is doing them or paying for them...if the employee has some time of commission based incentive, odd's are the customer is paying for them.
there is no perfect answer...we don't use piecework, I haven't figured out a simply way to do it fairly...we do however, offer base wages and commission.
but, to blindly dismiss piecework as an option is, in my opinion, wrong.
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