Square D quality going down?

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Installed a SQ D meter main yesterday. Not really a quality issue, more of a design issue:. Stupidly designed, super annoying. The channel piece that covers the line side conductors going up to the top meter lugs is annoying small in the flare out on the bottom to cover where the conduit entry is isn't big enough, it hits the conductors before you can bend them tight to the side. Then there is a cross member that you have to work the conductors through to get up to the top. It's just dumb and I was not a happy boy. I'm about done with square D.
 
Had installed four main lug Home line panels recently, not that I needed them but I noticed they didn't have bonding screws packed with them like they always used to.

Didn't have EGC bars either, though I do know they do have a separate catalog # for the ones that do have a ground bar included. Will need to order those separately I guess. Most all main lug loadcenters I've installed in the past always came with EGC bars, at least QO and CH always did. Haven't installed all that many of other brands.
 
kwired said:
Had installed four main lug Home line panels recently, not that I needed them but I noticed they didn't have bonding screws packed with them like they always used to.

Didn't have EGC bars either, though I do know they do have a separate catalog # for the ones that do have a ground bar included. Will need to order those separately I guess. Most all main lug loadcenters I've installed in the past always came with EGC bars, at least QO and CH always did. Haven't installed all that many of other brands.
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Big box even with CH never has the ground bar but I don't think I've ever seen one not come with a green bond screw so that must be their new cost cutting or something.
 
kwired said:
Had installed four main lug Home line panels recently, not that I needed them but I noticed they didn't have bonding screws packed with them like they always used to.

Didn't have EGC bars either, though I do know they do have a separate catalog # for the ones that do have a ground bar included. Will need to order those separately I guess. Most all main lug loadcenters I've installed in the past always came with EGC bars, at least QO and CH always did. Haven't installed all that many of other brands.
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Yeah that annoys me when load centers don't come with ground bars. Like come on, really, especially now with meter mains being so prevalent. Square the home line has never come with ground bars, not sure about QO.
 
letgomywago said:
Big box even with CH never has the ground bar but I don't think I've ever seen one not come with a green bond screw so that must be their new cost cutting or something.
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Main lug panels are usually considered as non-service panels so they would typically not need neutral-ground bonding, so manufacturers can save the pennies a green screw might cost. I remember comments from when people wanted to back feed breakers in these cheaper panels.
 
jim dungar said:
Main lug panels are usually considered as non-service panels so they would typically not need neutral-ground bonding, so manufacturers can save the pennies a green screw might cost. I remember comments from when people wanted to back feed breakers in these cheaper panels.
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The CH main lug panels I purchased from my supplier had EG bars in at least the last few years. IDR now if they had the bonding screw but I sure had plenty for all brands when I quit. Yes, we knew when to use them.
 
electrofelon said:
Yeah that annoys me when load centers don't come with ground bars. Like come on, really, especially now with meter mains being so prevalent. Square the home line has never come with ground bars, not sure about QO.
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I happened to look in catalog and they have separate catalog number for ones with ground bar. My guess is big box stores simply don't stock those.
jim dungar said:
Main lug panels are usually considered as non-service panels so they would typically not need neutral-ground bonding, so manufacturers can save the pennies a green screw might cost. I remember comments from when people wanted to back feed breakers in these cheaper panels.
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Though not done often I have used main lug and either back fed a main or with QO and Homeline their convertible mains are easy to put your own main in, particularly if you want something other than a 100, 125, 150 200 or 225 which is about all you will get factory installed for mains.

Need a 60 amp main? QOM breakers are available in 60 amp. 175 amp would be a somewhat rare one but could be field installed if you needed one.
 
Concerning the QO recall, what exactly is Sq D recommending someone, like a whole apartment complex do? I am looking at one with 300 of these recalled panels.

Do the panels have to be removed and replaced, only guts replaced, or is there a field repair?

I have seen some people talk about the torquing down on the neutral to box bolts, but I have not seen anything from SqD on it. I don't trust my reputation and maybe getting sued after a fire - on a few random videos?

I am just talking about small QOC30UF and QOC24UF apartment panels.
 
MPdesign said:
Concerning the QO recall, what exactly is Sq D recommending someone, like a whole apartment complex do? I am looking at one with 300 of these recalled panels.

Do the panels have to be removed and replaced, only guts replaced, or is there a field repair?

I have seen some people talk about the torquing down on the neutral to box bolts, but I have not seen anything from SqD on it. I don't trust my reputation and maybe getting sued after a fire - on a few random videos?

I am just talking about small QOC30UF and QOC24UF apartment panels.
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Submit a claim. Your SqD vendor will be able to provide you with the necessary paperwork.

And yes it’s just torquing the screw. They’ll send you a sheet with the torque specs.


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Thank you. If you have completed many of these, have you seen any with burns such that you have to do more?
 
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MPdesign said:
Thank you. If you have completed many of these, have you seen any with burns such that you have to do more?
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I’ve only looked at two and they were to spec.

I’ve done very little in resi over the last couple of years and I’ve been bidding with ABB exclusively on multi family.


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MPdesign said:
Concerning the QO recall, what exactly is Sq D recommending someone, like a whole apartment complex do? I am looking at one with 300 of these recalled panels.

Do the panels have to be removed and replaced, only guts replaced, or is there a field repair?

I have seen some people talk about the torquing down on the neutral to box bolts, but I have not seen anything from SqD on it. I don't trust my reputation and maybe getting sued after a fire - on a few random videos?

I am just talking about small QOC30UF and QOC24UF apartment panels.
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The issue was with the lug that tightens down onto the plug on neutral bar wasn't drilled/tapped properly at the factory and resulted in not making proper contact when they assembled it. You won't even have any problems if you never used any plug on neutral GFCI/AFCI's. The fix basically is to properly tighten that connection.
 
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