When do you consider yourself an electrician?

[JMR Construction]

Working pt in the electrical dept at a Home Depot, I can tell you a large number of guys consider themselves an electrician if they can identify what a wire nut is, or as some ask for, "the caps". Homeowners are very generous with the term as well, "My electrician said he can replace our 15 amp breaker with a 20 amp, which we need because the 15 amp trips when we plug in our two heaters". Anyway, I wasn't comfortable introducing myself as an electrician until I had about 4 years in the trade, around the time I got my journeymen's license.
As a side note, you would be shocked to see how many single pole 30 amp breakers we sell. In 25 years doing residential, commercial, and industrial, I've never had the need to install one.

A 30 amp 120 vac RV receptacle would require a single pole, 30 amp breaker.

 

[Sberry]

installer, but at a certain point I realized that I reliably knew more about the code and electrical theory than many EC's I encountered working for the same clients. Last couple years I'm calling them out for their major mistakes (swapped neutrals, missing EGC to outbuilding, etc.) on a fairly regular basis. So now when people ask me if I'm an electrician I just shrug and say 'yeah'.

This is a bit where I am at. There are lots in that book I dont know, most of it is passing interest or in special circumstances I am part of. The parts I do use I know well, like you said,,, in comparison to some stuff we see,,, not sure how to word this/that but I am sure you get that. Service entrance, ruff a house, rewire, every screw and staple, the special circuits, etc and small shop especially welders, comps, requirements and allowances etc. Cords, cord sizing with hi degree of awareness as to sizing for fault protection and methods,,, etc. Not at engineer level but what they meant when they designed it and how they comply with code.
Welding machines are especially interesting in this area, have all the requirement and allowance and so many fundamental principles wrapped up in 2 conductors and a ground. Welders prove a point as to how the fundamental circuyit hasnt changed for 100 years and how they have changed the nachine over so many generations to comply with code.
There seems to be some feeling that poco and outfits like nema and ul do not have standards and they can simply make it up. Seems so many have not read the front of the books and I do not mean study but simply miss the parts that reference the nec and that they cannot pass it if it violates a code standard, size of a cord, max load on fixture wires and what thoise outfits do is certify it is legal to plug in to a proper legal circuit. This includes the fact that it must be designed proper when the tool is depending on the breaker for its own fault protection,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, this I cant believe they are not beat in school with till itsa understood and have seen lots of guys with paper do not grasp this concept. That there is another current limiting function of the breaker besides thermal like on a power strip.
Lots of masters on electric on other forums do not seem too involved in making this clear. In some defence when the answer is 6 wire on every 50A welder then most of that takes care of itself. What is disapointing is the cheering section some guy gets when he comes along and says,,, well I used number 8 and 80 so it will run all my welders,,, thats ok cause it wont overheat the wire in the wall.
Very few say,,,, wait a minute,,, the 200A mig not sposed to be plugged in to an 80 circuit?

 

[Sberry]

Get in to one regarding welding benches, full of,,, I dont understand so,,, which is the dumbest statement,,, should be,, I dont understand,,,, why then? They tend to assue because they dont understand that the code is wrong and should he fixed or cant grasp that well if,,, is not the same as "it is". Almost teenage logic. I had to tell an operator this a while back,,, says,,, well my car is front wheel drive, I got to say,,, this aint your car and it aint front wheel drive, its a tractor with a backhoe.
Code is similar,,, some told me, I was always told got to be the 2 worst consultants on the planet and not the guy to do code study. I usually dont say much i the stores, on occasion I will ask a question. Guy tells me,,, they dont want them quoting code, its obvious why. Maybe they changed that,,, no, its been that way for 75 yrs.

 

[Sberry]

I am usually in a hurry, have my own concerns and am delicate about that, will help the confused lady get an outlet cover from the pile, not too long ago there was a young fella trying to be helpful and some sent her to get wire to connect the smokes and he was hunting for speaker wire and I point to the 14/3 and he wonders why so heavy and say,,, its connected to a 15A circuit and then it makes sense and everyone is a little relieved.
I am driven by demand,, I really dont care about it all for bout 1 simple reason. Its making a living, it can be simple as getting paid for work but the initial point for me it was a roadblock and after I call a bud to move an outlet doesnt seem all that difficult next time.
There is a drawback to that,,, very slow process learning hand to mouth and not all mentors are good or know. Some are smart enuf they learned their jobs now they are brilliant and maybe even smartest guy in the dept down at the plant,,, try to move to construction where it has to pass and someone can tell you that you dont know and understand or the world is competitive and they have to retire or move to the stock room.

 

[Sberry]

I have had handyman neighbors some good some bad, real bad cause they refuse to learn and I made some mistakes but one him and son install some panels and do an absolute beautiful job and then some cept for 1 thing. I got him aside and point to it, draw a pic, he says,,, ah.. and the lites come on, said no one explained it proper and his job worked and looked soooo good that no one give it a thought.
I was in another a while back had several methods of grounding incl none. We fix it it a few minutes.

 

[JMR Construction]

Back to the original question, it's subjective. For some, unless you've trained in a union outfit and gone through that program they won't consider you an electrician. For others, what matters is that you've passed a test and licensed yourself where you live -- regardless of your background or capabilities. Some are shocked to hear it, but some areas do not have electrician specific licensing. Some places do not even have licensing or code enforcement at all (yes, in the U.S). In these areas it may not matter how many tens of thousands of feet of wire you've pulled, how many panels or meter loops you've installed, or even if you work with POCOs and AHJs to accomplish your work -- you may still not be considered electrician by many.

My opinion (which will not matter to some), is that you are an electrician when you can complete your work unsupervised in a safe, professional, and code compliant manner, understand why, and that you are able to perform such work legally where you live.

FYI, by your definition I would be a #5, though I haven't worked under anyone for a long time.

 

[RAKocher]

I was 8 years old the first time I remember being an electrician's helper. My Dad would take me with him while he was wiring the house that my Mom and him bought pre-construction. I would watch him work and I do remember carrying things for him. As young teenagers my brother and I often worked for my Dad. Then I worked for 2 other electrical companies doing mostly new work. When I was 24 I took a test at my County Seat for a Masters license. That was all over 40 years ago, and I'm still employed with a title of Electrician for a large hospital. The county that I live in discontinued trades licensing and the state never did, so using the word license in your definitions is probably not an accurate description.
I'm the only electrician where I work, so I design, refer to code as needed and order all of my material. last week I installed 50' of EMT for an outdoor 50 amp receptacle that had over 440 degrees of bends, besides several stub bends an offset from strut to minerallac strap and a 3 point saddle, but I did get help from a carpenter and a plumber to pull the wire. I often do projects like this for the hospital, so what am I?

 

[Another C10]

I'd say there are variations of the electrician.
an apprentice electrician owns the title electrician but they are learning the basics and have a long way to go granted they typically know more than the framer or drywaller.

I own the title of electrical contractor simply because I took the exam and got a license from the state I live in.

The truth is there are a vast group of electricians all in which Excell in their expertice.

I'm basically a construction electrician with good installation and troubleshooting skills some are experts at motor control or solar arrays. As my instructor use to say " you can't be an expert in all the aspects of electricity" but you can get really good and earn a very good living at a variety of specific skills.

Alot of it has to do with opportunity, some grew up around motors and transformers some grew up around construction and some grew up around machinery.

Their all good, some pay better than others and some have better working environments. Just pick the area you Excell in and work hard at it.

 

[Sea Nile]

so what am I?

I like @JMR Construction's definition for you. Also, You are an electrician because you are competent and it's how you earn your living.

 

[Sberry]

I have done this in a couple trades. In my case, have worked in them but now my work is intermit and dont get a chance to refine some of it thru constant repetition and almost all of it is design and build. So, I have seen some creations and had to deal with a few, the supply guy sends wire I spec to my job thinking he is doing me a favor giving me a roll end a size bigger and 2x as long but I had sized all the rest of it 150 etc and even used the buck and a half from them as it was not sitting in a box store.
I think I have it designed with ese till I find the big wire, my helper is crafty and we got thru it and after the fact I really looked at the elevations and realize should have went thru a block and elim an lb, insp says, good job but I know what I would do different and just missed it. I went thru a stage where I looked at meter bases and installs and even drive around the neighborhood and see whats typical and doesnt look like Dr Suess attacked it with lbs elbows and couplings and often can elinate it all cept for 2 male threaded adapters and 3 inch pc of pipe.
Takes about 3/4 of the work out of bending conductors and ends up with less restraint.

 

[Sberry]

I studied cause I got tired of the hearsay and even guys new couldnt splain it right or quick and as was said, the specialty. Aint always the most best sparky wires the new casino, other skill sets come in to the pic. I am terrible at controls relays even 3 and 4 way switches, I got a helper for that shite and I am drilling holes and routing due to mostly the design build nature, even wire count where there are extremely difficult routes and not drilling extra holes and not missing or undersized doing gang pulls of wire.
I ruffed one for a bud a while back and he said that, I was amazed at how fast it went, I would be trying to pull 1 cable at a time and even end up with lots of extra stapling,,, which happens in remodel, been there with that

 

[rambojoe]

I've noticed that 100% of demons, ghosts, apparitions and serial murderers consider them selves electricians, even if it just means hitting the main or floating neutrals.. Small observation.

 

[Sberry]

My interest being I own a lot of equipment that people come in contact with. I had a risk audit from an underwriter and he actually gave an upgrade instead of depreciation, got 5% discount. The agent commented that its rather rare. UL listed stuff, piped wiring, plumbed utilities, modern steel buildings. Basic fire stuff. They go thru a checklist and start zinging yes and after a few things they get bored.
On occasion I get a truck inspection or did due to the fact its a fee but only a check box on a form if asked but not really tied directly other than in an accident. In todays world that com annual isnt zilch and it should easily pass. The guy uses to say that,,, you are a guy should have it inspected, you pass easy.

 

[augie47]

During the past 6 decades I occasionally thought I was an electrician and have a lot of pieces of paper that say I am but then I came here and met some of the senior, experienced members and realize I don't make a pimple on a REAL electricians ass

 

[Sea Nile]

During the past 6 decades I occasionally thought I was an electrician and have a lot of pieces of paper that say I am but then I came here and met some of the senior, experienced members and realize I don't make a pimple on a REAL electricians ass

I think it's comparable to the medical field. No one can know everything, but a lot of people specialize

God I hope that didn't come off as patronizing...

 

[tthh]

My youngest is a CPA. She used some exam prep materials for the CPA exams and they included videos as well as written materiel. She was telling me that the two main guys in the videos would say "if you think you've studied enough and know it all and got it all down now, you're going to fail". It is the same for any profession where there is a lot to know and you have to use your brain.

 

[mark32]

During the past 6 decades I occasionally thought I was an electrician and have a lot of pieces of paper that say I am but then I came here and met some of the senior, experienced members and realize I don't make a pimple on a REAL electricians ass

You are being overly modest Augie! I don't spend as much time on here as I have in the past, but in my mind, I have a vision of the elite members of this site, I can't name them all at the moment, but certainly you are in the upper echelon indeed.

 

[mtnelect]

You are not an "Electrician" until you have gotten shocked !
Your not a roofer until you have fallen off a roof !
Which means, that you have not met that standard, then you are a "Paper Pusher" !

 

[mark32]

A 30 amp 120 vac RV receptacle would require a single pole, 30 amp breaker.

For sure, there are legit applications for such a breaker, but in the context of the discussion, I'm referring to the diy homeowner and handymen that gobble them up. I should check the sales figures on them and report back

 

[letgomywago]

I think it's comparable to the medical field. No one can know everything, but a lot of people specialize

God I hope that didn't come off as patronizing...

I think you're right there are guys who don't know theory or how to design but can bed efficiently and follow plans with great detail. There are those who understand complicated industrial controls but can do residential fast enough to make minimum wage. Shrinks know how the brain works with emotions and when to draw the line between therapy and drugs and dermatologists know when it's auto immune and when it's an infection. Either guy can be an expert but neither would be the one should do each other specialty without more training.