who owns the tools you use

[jaylectricity]

My guess it is because of his attitude about being slow.

It's a good guess, but he was stating that his "being slow" had more to do with the tools the company wasn't providing him with, not his basic attitude.

 

[480sparky]

I can see what Marc is saying about using the tools you like but a bender does not generally wear out. With batteries at better then $80.00 each I have no desire to subsidize the company.

That said for 'one of jobs' I have brought all sorts of stuff from home, from rigging equipment, to staging, I even brought my snowblower with me to work to make the day more productive. But I don't see any need for me to provide something like a cordless drill every day.

You are, however, more likely to take better care of a tool if you paid for it.

 

[satcom]

I'm not 100% sure I like where you're going with that. It is just as valid of an option when staffing work as any other. On the face, it might seem like employing illegals, which may be what he does, but let's not assume that right off the bat, por favor.

Anyone working by the hour is in chains, and when they go on their own buy tool to speed things up because it then benifits them.

Bottom line, hourly hand tools only.

I remember going to a job where the guys were all using hand taps, when they went on their own they used gun taps.

 

[jaylectricity]

You are, however, more likely to take better care of a tool if you paid for it.

Then you should still get an allowance for those tools --OR-- you get tax exemptions on your salary for business expenses. If you use your tools to make more money for the company, you should be compensated for that.

Trust me, if I get an extra $1-$2 an hour for purchasing some tools that make me work faster I have no complaints. I can use that money to buy $80 a week in tools (including replacing worn tools and dead batteries) and I'll also try to take care of them so I can pocket more of the cash instead of playing the "throw-away society" game.

 

[480sparky]

Then you should still get an allowance for those tools --OR-- you get tax exemptions on your salary for business expenses.

You mean you don't already deduct the cost of your tools that are required by your employer?

 

[iwire]

You are, however, more likely to take better care of a tool if you paid for it.

Actually I treat the company tools pretty darn well, but I certainly agree that can be a problem. I have yelled at employees mistreating tools.

Regardless IMO that problem is the business owners, either assign the tools to particular people and hold them to some level of responsibility or assign a person to check the tools in at the end of the day.

 

[480sparky]

Actually I treat the company tools pretty darn well, but I certainly agree that can be a problem. I have yelled at employees mistreating tools.

Regardless IMO that problem is the business owners, either assign the tools to particular people and hold them to some level of responsibility or assign a person to check the tools in at the end of the day.

I always treated company tools as if they were my own, but far to many of my coworkers didn't.

I remember seeing several brand new fish tapes sent to a job, and by the end of the week they were all laying out in the parking lot (pulling light poles that week), sitting in the snow. They soon got covered up and the GC trashed them when he used a skid loader to clear the lot.

Another option is to provide an employee with the tools, and tell them, "Here they are, but they are your responsibility. If you lose them or destroy them, you are responsible for their replacement."

 

[jaylectricity]

You mean you don't already deduct the cost of your tools that are required by your employer?

I don't have an employer, so no. But I guess I was agreeing with that modus operandi.

 

[iwire]

Another option is to provide an employee with the tools, and tell them, "Here they are, but they are your responsibility. If you lose them or destroy them, you are responsible for their replacement."

That of course is up to you and the people you hire, I would not be into that.

Where would you draw the line?

Cordless drill?

Threader?

Pulling equipment?

 

[satcom]

Actually I treat the company tools pretty darn well, but I certainly agree that can be a problem. I have yelled at employees mistreating tools.

Regardless IMO that problem is the business owners, either assign the tools to particular people and hold them to some level of responsibility or assign a person to check the tools in at the end of the day.

Your the exception, respecting the tool prlivages, but you do have a good point about the employeers holding them to some level of responsibility.
The enployeer that tools up the workers, benifits in increased production, as the one comment said, I work hourly.

 

[480sparky]

That of course is up to you and the people you hire, I would not be into that.

Where would you draw the line?

Cordless drill?

Threader?

Pulling equipment?

You provide a list of tools that you have assigned to an employee, and they agree they are responsible for those tools. I know of several outfits that use this system. Employer buys the tools, but if the employee is careless and loses them, he needs to pony since he's responsible.

Large tools, like a threader or puller, is assigned to a job. You can't expect a cubby to be responsible for a 4-digit tool.

 

[emahler]

I'm not trying to bash you here but as far as I can tell most of the people in the previous 7 pages of this thread thought the worker should have hand tools and maybe a drill.

Why do you think wireman71 would be unemployed?

it's not the part about who provides tools...it's this part

If not having other needed tools slows the job down I just remember I get paid by the hour.

reason being, it's a two way street...if the tool is broken because someone on site didn't treat it right, or it's on another job until tomorrow, or it's just not there for any reason...find something else productive to do on that job...

the attitude of "i don't care, i get paid by the hour" sucks...

as an employer we provide everything but hand tools and cordless...we will replace worn out batteries, but i won't provide cordless tools anymore...matter of fact, if we had all the money spent on replacing tools that were broken, lost, misplaced, stolen, etc over the years, I would be retired in the caribbean.

so, when the company wireman works for goes out of business because too many guys have the "i don't care, i work by the hour" attitude and jobs start running way over budget...i wonder if his unemployment will be hourly or weekly?

 

[iwire]

matter of fact, if we had all the money spent on replacing tools that were broken, lost, misplaced, stolen, etc over the years, I would be retired in the caribbean.

And if you got all your material for free life would be better as well.

Stop paying your taxes, that will be better as well, at least for a while.

 

[emahler]

And if you got all your material for free life would be better as well.

Stop paying your taxes, that will be better as well, at least for a while.

bob, reread my post...replaced is the key word...don't obfuscate the point

 

[jaylectricity]

it's not the part about who provides tools...it's this part


reason being, it's a two way street...if the tool is broken because someone on site didn't treat it right, or it's on another job until tomorrow, or it's just not there for any reason...find something else productive to do on that job...

the attitude of "i don't care, i get paid by the hour" sucks...

as an employer we provide everything but hand tools and cordless...we will replace worn out batteries, but i won't provide cordless tools anymore...matter of fact, if we had all the money spent on replacing tools that were broken, lost, misplaced, stolen, etc over the years, I would be retired in the caribbean.

so, when the company wireman works for goes out of business because too many guys have the "i don't care, i work by the hour" attitude and jobs start running way over budget...i wonder if his unemployment will be hourly or weekly?

I completely agree with your statement, however I don't believe that was the intent of the original statement. He never said, "I don't care, I work by the hour," he said:

If not having other needed tools slows the job down I just remember I get paid by the hour.

I take that to mean that if the employer isn't providing the tools to get the job done quickly, wireman71 is willing to put his nose to the grindstone and complete the work with the tools available. He doesn't mention anything about his unwillingness to take care of tools, keep them clean or put them away. He only mentions the lack of the employer providing the tools in the first place.

And if you got all your material for free life would be better as well.

Stop paying your taxes, that will be better as well, at least for a while.

I am intrigued by your ideas...might you have a newsletter I can subscribe to?

 

[emahler]

jayelectricity...check back with me after you get some employees under your belt

 

[iwire]

don't obfuscate the point

I learned from you Dad! :grin:

 

[emahler]

I learned from you Dad! :grin:

well then...keep practicing

 

[jaylectricity]

jayelectricity...check back with me after you get some employees under your belt

heh heh... I hope that day never comes. I've heard enough stories from Davis9 to know that you speak the truth.

 

[bikeindy]

I can see what Marc is saying about using the tools you like but a bender does not generally wear out. With batteries at better then $80.00 each I have no desire to subsidize the company.

That said for 'one of jobs' I have brought all sorts of stuff from home, from rigging equipment, to staging, I even brought my snowblower with me to work to make the day more productive. But I don't see any need for me to provide something like a cordless drill every day.

As the owner and a former employee I see both sides of this. I once had a guy working for me who brought every tool under the sun with him and he did it because he liked his tools. they made him more productive but also made his job easier. That was the attitude I had when I was working for some one. If I am more productive than other guys I get paid more, If I use tools I like I enjoy the job more.

As an owner I provide tools for guys to use that I like and find to be more productive for me. I have to buy batteries not from being worn out but because the get forgotten on jobs. I don't like that, and I told the guys if you like using cordless stuff you will have to keep the batteries around or I might buy some hand drills for them to use for a day.