who supplies the meter??

[infinity]

Jersey: Disconnect, rip out old service, install new service, reconnect with permanent connection, leave, and wait for local inspection. Inspector then sends a cut-in card to the Utility. Utility sends out their inspector. Don't wait for Utility linemen to make finally connections. they may never change your connection, but they will install a new meter.

You're right. I said basically the same thing. IMO it's an excellent system. For the EC the job gets done in one trip to the house and the customer's downtime is minimal. Everyone ends up happy.

 

[electricguy61]

Sounds like a crappy POCO to me. Borrowing power from a neighbor? Five days for a reconnect? They're only in business because they are a monopoly.

I couldn't agree more!

But they are a monopoly, and all the contractors are stuck.

 

[LarryFine]

Wow!
So they'll Install a thru the roof mast on an upgrade?
So does one put a 2/0 onto a 100amp meter socket?

I'm guessing the PoCo in Larry's area is responsible for the wiring on the line side of the meter. I have a hard time believing the PoCo is going to install a through-the-roof mast. Probably the EC installs the meter socket, mast, and weather head, but only installs wiring on the load side. Then I bet the PoCo comes in and puts their wires through the weather head, down the mast, and connects to the line side of the meter.

Is this how it works, Larry?

My bad! I left out that we're responsible for providing the point of attachment, because we rarely have to re-do the eye-bolt or mast. On a service change, they're almost always suitable for re-use.

On new work, of course we are responsible for the point-of-attachment, but again, the wiring only from the load terminals on. I wish we could land our driven-grounds here. There's a lug for it that we can't use.

 

[LarryFine]

The green # 12 hanging out of the back of the meter adapter clips onto the metal enclosure and is used when your meter socket doesn't have a 5th jaw.

Does this mean that the green wire, which you clipped to the cable camp in the last image, is your neutral? That would be necessary to avoid feeding the GFCI with 240v. Why not add a white wire, even if you have to drill a hole in the base, to clip to the can's neutral?

 

[GUNNING]

We have a POCO that gives you an appointment in two weeks to disconnect a melting service. They don't supply the meter can anymore but do the meter. The local AHJ wont inspect anything without a 24 hour prior notice; nor is anything allowed to be energized without there blessing. The POCO WILL send a letter to the state complaining if you mess with there lines. and the AHJ WILL send a letter to the state complaining about the local POCO if they energize something with out there blessing. Everyone has a finger in the pie and are more than willing to show it to you.

I try not to do services here and wish they didn't risk my life when I do work on them. A few years ago they chewed out someone calling in on a POCO truck radio telling the dispatcher there lineman was on fire and was dying on a pole, they almost didn't send any help. The only reason they sent someone out was to "get" the guy that made the radio call.
MY advice is to let someone else do that service.

 

[goldstar]

Does this mean that the green wire, which you clipped to the cable camp in the last image, is your neutral? That would be necessary to avoid feeding the GFCI with 240v. Why not add a white wire, even if you have to drill a hole in the base, to clip to the can's neutral?

Larry,

The green color on the wire has no bearing on anything. That's what I had in the truck at the time I made this thing. Inside the meter adapter it is attached to the neutral side of the GFI receptacle. This unit is only wired for 120 vac. When you have a meter pan with a 5th jaw the wire does not have to get clipped onto the metal enclosure.

 

[hardworkingstiff]

On new work, of course we are responsible for the point-of-attachment, but again, the wiring only from the load terminals on. I wish we could land our driven-grounds here. There's a lug for it that we can't use.

It was a suprise to me when I left Virginia and moved to North Carolina.

What do you mean you don't supply the meterbase? LOL

No eyebolt either? (Larry, VEPCO, ugh I mean Va. Power still supply the eyebolt too?)

 

[goldstar]

Can anyone tell me why my photos showed up inside the post as opposed to just the link ? Just trying to learn so I don't take up so much space.

Bob (iwire) maybe you could shed some light.

Thanks,

Phil

Never mind. Figured it out myself. I used

 

[LarryFine]

Putting an image's url between these

places the image in the post. (Delete space)

Putting an image's url between these

 

[LarryFine]

Larry,

The green color on the wire has no bearing on anything.

Of course not! I mentioned color for clarity of my suggestion.

Inside the meter adapter it is attached to the neutral side of the GFI receptacle. This unit is only wired for 120 vac. When you have a meter pan with a 5th jaw the wire does not have to get clipped onto the metal enclosure.

I understand. It's just that I'd rather clip a neutral to the can's neutral bus than to an external enclosure. Plus, if it's behind the meter, it can't accidentally be tugged off.

In any case, I have separate neutral and ground clips on mine, so I maintain one even if the other pops off. I use a 4-conductor rubber cord with 50-amp clips.

 

[Minuteman]

Jersey: Disconnect, rip out old service, install new service, reconnect with permanent connection, leave, and wait for local inspection. Inspector then sends a cut-in card to the Utility. Utility sends out their inspector. Don't wait for Utility linemen to make finally connections. they may never change your connection, but they will install a new meter.

That's how it is here too, except in one suburb that has a city poco, they want to do it all and get HIGHLY INDIGNANT if we touch their toys.

 

[jeff43222]

I had an electrical service torn off a home by a felled tree. I called PG&E, reported the situation, pulled a permit, and installed a new service. I re-connected the incoming overhead lines, called for inspection (which passed), and called PG&E for a re-connection. The employee that came out for PG&E reported the customer for power theft. The customer was fined $500 (which I split with the customer). Ever since, I don't touch PG&E's meter or overhead lines.

How is it theft if all the power is taken from the load side of the meter?

Unfortunately, it can take up to 5 days from disconnection to re-connection, but I can usually hook up a 2 pole 20amp w/ 12/3 romex to a neighbor for temporary power.

Sounds like a dumb way to do things. What if the neighbor isn't feeling so generous?

 

[jeff43222]

We have a POCO that gives you an appointment in two weeks to disconnect a melting service. They don't supply the meter can anymore but do the meter. The local AHJ wont inspect anything without a 24 hour prior notice; nor is anything allowed to be energized without there blessing. The POCO WILL send a letter to the state complaining if you mess with there lines. and the AHJ WILL send a letter to the state complaining about the local POCO if they energize something with out there blessing. Everyone has a finger in the pie and are more than willing to show it to you.

Too bad the various entities there don't seem to want to get along. Around here, I've had PoCo people actually suggest that I work on their wires! They've told me I could trench out to their pole and connect to their lines for a new underground service, and they said I could move an underground service while it was live. I declined on both occasions.

I try not to do services here and wish they didn't risk my life when I do work on them. A few years ago they chewed out someone calling in on a POCO truck radio telling the dispatcher there lineman was on fire and was dying on a pole, they almost didn't send any help. The only reason they sent someone out was to "get" the guy that made the radio call.
MY advice is to let someone else do that service.

I feel the opposite. I wish I had more services to do. Services are good, solid jobs that most DIYers won't attempt themselves, so people are more willing to spend the money. Dealing with the PoCo and the AHJ aren't a problem, either.

 

[Minuteman]

I feel the opposite. I wish I had more services to do. Services are good, solid jobs that most DIYers won't attempt themselves, so people are more willing to spend the money. Dealing with the PoCo and the AHJ aren't a problem, either.

I agree with Jeff. My profit margin is more on a service repair/upgrade than on a new house.

 

[LarryFine]

I agree, too. I'm thinking of adding a big "~Service Upgrade Specialists~" to our next phone-book ad cycle.

The co-op I mentioned earlier won't even let us touch the meter seal. They disconnect in the AM and reconnect only after the inspection email/fax. Fortunately, they and that county are very co-operative (pun intended) about getting re-energized the same day. A few hoops, but the customers seem to like it.

 

[electricguy61]

How is it theft if all the power is taken from the load side of the meter?

Sounds like a dumb way to do things. What if the neighbor isn't feeling so generous?

1) We didn't steal any power. But if the meter enclosure doesn't have a seal, they can, by law, assume you did steal power. Admittedly, most PG&E lineman are really good about this sort of thing, but as my case shows, it's not worth the risk to my company to mess with the POCO's side of the meter.

2) Of all the services I've done since then (probably 20 in 3 years), no neighbor has ever said "no" to borrowing a little juice. I usually suggest the homeowner buy them a nice bottle of wine as a thank you, or I do a service call type repair for them. I often end up replacing the neighbors service as well, because so many homes out here were wired with Zinsco or Federal Pacific panels that are either full or failing.

3) It may be a "dumb" way to do things, but the POCO's and muncipalities make the rules, and we have to play by them.

 

[jeff43222]

If I had to play by those rules, I wouldn't touch PoCo stuff, either.

I have no idea how many meter seals I've broken, but it's been a fair number. I occasionally even crack them open when troubleshooting power quality problems. PoCo doesn't mind at all. I guess we don't have as many problems with power theft around here, unlike our neighbor to the east.

 

[GUNNING]

That's what I don't get. There isn't much power theft here. There isn't anyone swapping meters, bypassing meters, shunting power to the load side of the meter, none of that. Yet the yokal locals look at the sanctity of the meter base as a zero sum power game. The homeowner with a melting meter base is treated like a criminal on probation. The electrician is at the whim of one or two individuals that have no practical knowledge of the problem. The local PoCo stopped having a trouble shooting crew because there overtime wasn't cost effective. That translates into making more than there supervisor because they would work 70 hour weeks late into the night alone on live high voltage lines.
I'm hoping this doesn't sound too bitter, it's just frustrating not to be able to help my neighbors and customers. Its just plain Civilly bankrupt.

 

[jeff43222]

Well, you could always relocate up here, where we love winter almost as much as we love the other month.

Coincidentally, I'm heading out to look at a job for my neighbor, whose mast was ripped off his house the last time we had a big storm roll through a few weeks ago. Unfortunately, he was out of the country at the time. A neighbor called the PoCo when it happened, and they had a crew temping up power to his house about two hours later. I talked to the PoCo guys, and they showed me what they did and advised me on how to take the temp clamp off their meter when I rebuild the service and connect to their wires.

 

[goldstar]

This is a follow up to my post regarding tombstone meter sockets. The first photo shows a tombstone meter enclosure. The first photo is an updated version of the original and actually has a meter socket. The original ones had wires coming out of the meter itself and wired directly to the terminals and thus the need for meter adapters (last 2 pix).

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k130/goldstar13397/DSCN00220023.jpg

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k130/goldstar13397/DSCN00240025.jpg

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k130/goldstar13397/DSCN00230024.jpg