Why is Knoxville and East Tennessee exempt from following the NEC?

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jmellc said:
I've seen UL labels on equipment that had reverse hot and neutral connections to pilot lights; had line to screw shell & neutral to pin. Seen loose ground screws. Seen junction boxes so small they wouldn't meet code if we used them for anything.

UL is mainly a money racket with safety as their buzz word.
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You do know UL doesn't evaluate every individual item made and that there can be imperfections. Some of what you mentioned is maybe QC issues with whoever manufactured the item.
 
I've wondered why a company would pay big money to get something ul-listed if it's nothing but junk. I've seen it a few times.

The market should just push that product out of existence, and all of the money spent to get it listed would be a waste.

It just seems reasonable to me that having something listed would denote a certain level of quality
 
James L said:
I've wondered why a company would pay big money to get something ul-listed if it's nothing but junk. I've seen it a few times.

The market should just push that product out of existence, and all of the money spent to get it listed would be a waste.

It just seems reasonable to me that having something listed would denote a certain level of quality
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It does not mean quality at all. It just means that UL evaluated one or more samples and found that the samples met the requirements for that product.

Incidentally, UL listing is normally not as expensive in the grand scheme of things as you think. It is not free but if handled correctly, it is not a huge added expense, especially for components that are being built in quantities where the added cost can be spread out over enough units that it just does not matter. It usually costs more to ship the part from China than it does to get it UL listed.

What is expensive is one up products or products where someone who does not understand the process tries to deal with UL on their own to save money. It never works out that they save any money, but some people are just too cheap for their own good.
 
electrofelon said:
Actually believe it or not that probably was fine. If you look at the allowable holes information from the manufacturer of those wooden I joists, you may be surprised what you can do. I specifically remember one time I was checking the allowed holes spec sheet and it specifically saying that the entire web can be removed, I think it just couldn't be within a few feet of the ends.
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Right!

See page 7 of this document:


This is a major reason I-Joists became so popular.

And as an electrician, you can punch (drill) up to a 1 1/2" hole anywhere in the web (except within 3" of another hole).
 
Frank DuVal said:
Right!

See page 7 of this document:


This is a major reason I-Joists became so popular.

And as an electrician, you can punch (drill) up to a 1 1/2" hole anywhere in the web (except within 3" of another hole).
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Look further down on the tables, you can have much larger holes.

Plus it makes no sense to me that if you can have say an 8 inch hole why it should matter if you put multiple smaller holes within that same 8 inch diameter?
 
James L said:
I've wondered why a company would pay big money to get something ul-listed if it's nothing but junk. I've seen it a few times.

The market should just push that product out of existence, and all of the money spent to get it listed would be a waste.

It just seems reasonable to me that having something listed would denote a certain level of quality
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Some states like mine, NC, require that electrical products be lab certified. UL is the most famous lab, of course. A former boss had a list of about a dozen labs that NC recognizes. But few people would recognize them so UL is the major player in that game, the “safety mafia”, as I see it.
 
jmellc said:
Some states like mine, NC, require that electrical products be lab certified. UL is the most famous lab, of course. A former boss had a list of about a dozen labs that NC recognizes. But few people would recognize them so UL is the major player in that game, the “safety mafia”, as I see it.
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Back in the day, we used ETL quite a bit. They cost less than UL and were easier to work with. Never had a case where that wasn’t acceptable. But that was 30 years ago!
 
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