Why not use aluminum

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GG

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I hear on the news from time to time about thieves stealing copper wire from rooftops, light poles at parks, etc. Why dont the installers use aluminum conductors that would not be worth much at all if stolen and most likely would not even be stolen by a copper thief?
 
GG said:
I hear on the news from time to time about thieves stealing copper wire from rooftops, light poles at parks, etc. Why dont the installers use aluminum conductors that would not be worth much at all if stolen and most likely would not even be stolen by a copper thief?
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In some cases the wire has been installed for years while other times it is speced by engineers. Copper is more money but conduit sizes must be increased for the comparable aluminum ampacity.

I did a house and they went in and took all the nm cable.
 
yea I don't think the theif will know the difference until some damage is done.
 
zbang said:
Not too bright, usually.
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I know this isn't the spirit of the forum, but that kind of thinking will make you a victim.

There are many many many smart criminals, some that even steal copper successfully. You don't ever hear of those guys. You just hear about the ones that electrocute themselves trying to steal live wires, or the ones who just show up at the scrapyard with a roll of copper only a POCO would carry around. Don't lull yourself into a false sense of security believing that all copper thieves are junkies looking for a fix.
 
I know of a baseball park here that got hit for its pole lights copper and the news said the copper was in the $10,000 range. So someone had to of planned that "job" out. The poles are 40' + tall.
 
jaylectricity said:
I know this isn't the spirit of the forum, but that kind of thinking will make you a victim.
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No, it makes me a realist. Most thieves aren't very smart, which is why they're doing it in the first place. It doesn't take much in the way of smarts to strip a house under construction, especially when it's not secured. OTOH there are some very intelligent thieves out there, but they've figured out the balance of risk/reward. A night's work to get $40k of wire? That's pretty good. To get $40? Wouldn't cover bail, but doesn't stop them from trying.
 
GG said:
I know of a baseball park here that got hit for its pole lights copper and the news said the copper was in the $10,000 range. So someone had to of planned that "job" out. The poles are 40' + tall.
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If $10k was the news report then it was the retail purchase value. Far less in value at the scrap yard.

zbang said:
No, it makes me a realist. Most thieves aren't very smart, which is why they're doing it in the first place. It doesn't take much in the way of smarts to strip a house under construction, especially when it's not secured. OTOH there are some very intelligent thieves out there, but they've figured out the balance of risk/reward. A night's work to get $40k of wire? That's pretty good. To get $40? Wouldn't cover bail, but doesn't stop them from trying.
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Yea. I've heard of two thieves that did less than five years each. They still have the $2M+ they stole. On the other hand, the guy who broke in our place stole $200, had to pay it back, and spend up to 10 years in jail. Different IQ levels there for sure.
 
Around here, you can't find aluminum smaller than #8 and even then, it's part of a cable assembly usually so AL is pretty much reserved for service entrance conductors, feeders or larger branch circuits. CU is much more readily available for most situations.
 
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I have a customer that wants all his trailers service feeds replaced with aluminum. All the copper was stolen from them and he said when he installs aluminum they dont touch it. The exisitng copper keeps getting stolen and the new aluminum he had done last year is still there. I dont know if 200 amp aluminum rated service wires will fit in a 2" conduit. I have to look into it.
 
GG said:
I have a customer that wants all his trailers service feeds replaced with aluminum. All the copper was stolen from them and he said when he installs aluminum they dont touch it. The exisitng copper keeps getting stolen and the new aluminum he had done last year is still there. I dont know if 200 amp aluminum rated service wires will fit in a 2" conduit. I have to look into it.
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If you're sizing according to 310.15.B.6, you can use 4/0 AL for 200A service. That would fit in a 2" pipe.
 
zbang said:
I doubt that the thieves are going to check before they start cutting. Heck, they might not even notice it's not copper. Not too bright, usually.
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If they cut through SE cable they'll get real bright for a few seconds. :happyyes:
 
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