Why should hire an electrican?

[highkvoltage]

I had a guy call me today to look at a job. He hired a HVAC tech to wire his addition to his house. After looking at the job he did my only reconmended we just tear it all out and start over. He almost cried. To give you guys an example of the craftsmanship this guy used 2/0 split bolt to put the romex grounds together in the switch boxes. The electric inspector was there and just shook his head and told the homeowner he didn't have enough paper to write down all the violations and told him to get a real EC. Then this guy keeps asking if I could help him out because he already paid the other guy. I ask him if he was joking. I still got the job T and M.

 

[physis]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

It's a sad story to say the least.

The man probably didn't think it was big difference between the HVAC guy or an electrician, And some HVAC guys are real good.

I think given that the HVAC guy was way more than likely operating illegaly, that you can maybe recommend to the property owner to scare the HVAC guy into not needing even near full payment because of how concerned the building department has become over the situation.

 

[George Stolz]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

Sounds like the HVAC guy was paid, if not in full then a lot. Whoops.

 

[davedottcom]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

Damn...this guy was listed as the EC on the permit? How is that even possible? The HVAC guys can't even pull their own T-Stat wire in FL! (Unless they have an Electrical License too)

Dave

 

[bthielen]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

I don't know how much it cost to hire the HVAC person and I don't know what legal ramifications are involved but assuming that laws are in place that require licensing, this homeowner may have legal avenues at his disposal to recover what he has paid the HVAC person or the cost of the corrections. If he was not properly licensed according to the law in his area, he may just prefer to settle out of court rather than face court costs plus fines and whatever. If an inspector was involved, the homeowner would seem to have a open and shut case.

Bob

 

[lady sparks lover]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

Originally posted by highkvoltage:
I still got the job T and M.

Sorry, to hear about this. I hear this all the time. This guy probably gave him a deal, or was adament about how good his work is. I would have him reported, or his licensed pulled if I were him.


Lady

 

[peter d]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

I blame the homeowner for hiring an HVAC tech to do electrical work. This is just plain common sense, which apparently isn't very common. The same situation would be to hire a roofer to build a foundation.

I know a lot of HVAC guys and plumbers think they can do electrical work but they are some of the most dangerous hacks out there from what I've seen.

 

[bthielen]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

Peter,

You are correct that the homeowner is partially responsible because he hired the individual without verifying his credentials. At the same time, we don't know the law in his area regarding licensing requirements. It is entirely possible (don't know for sure) that the HVAC person misrepresented himself or perhaps the homeowner was fully aware that the tech was not properly licensed and hired him anyway. There are a lot of unanswered questions so we cannot make any true judgement.

In either case, if the law requires proper licensing, the HVAC tech should be held responsible. The homeowner is getting his due by the additional cost of doing the job right.

Bob

 

[benaround]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

Highvoltage,

Even though you got the job T&M, Don't let this guy get to far ahead of you( that's my feeling) "can you help me out I already paid the other guy" , What kind of person would say something like that?

frank

 

[electricmanscott]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

Originally posted by bthielen:


There are a lot of unanswered questions so we cannot make any true judgement.

I can. Homeowner screwed up. probably was "getting a good deal" amd got burned. Live and learn.

 

[highkvoltage]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

In our county homeowner's can pull the permit which is whst happened in this case. Yes the HVAC guy was paid. I had the home owner tear it all out and started the rewire today. I am going down Monday to repull the permit under my EC license even though they have a permit I can pay for a new one issued to me. I have arqued this with the county until I was turning blue that when most homeowner's pull a permit they are pulling it for Joe Blow Electric. Until this is resolved I will have plenty of work. Over the last 2 years this has to be the 8th job like this. I have the standard that I will not repair bad wiring. Tear it all out and I will make it right with the big bill. My T and M price for this is $700 a day plus material. We should be done tomorrow. I'm just trying to fit this in normally I will not work on Sunday. He will then pay $45 an hour for finish plus material.

 

[highkvoltage]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

I did by the way show him what the costwould have been if he would have just hired a EC from the beginning and asked him how did really save in the long run. Over all he out abour $1400. He admits he was at fault for trying to save money and will hire me do work on his rentals.

 

[peter d]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

Well, if the homeowner got a permit for an HVAC hack, then I really have no sympathy for him.


Live and learn.

 

[peter d]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

Originally posted by highkvoltage:
He admits he was at fault for trying to save money and will hire me do work on his rentals.

A silver lining to this cloud at least.

 

[physis]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

Yeah, the old do it wrong under a home owner permit because it's really cheap that way routine.

I know I'm takin' the other side now Scott.

 

[electricmanscott]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

Originally posted by peter d:
Well, if the homeowner got a permit for an HVAC hack, then I really have no sympathy for him.

Nor do I BUT, are we saying that since the work was done horribly by another person and you are redoing the work you are free to overcharge. It seems that for the rough your rate is $87.50 and finish is $45.00. Why the discrepancy? I have no problem charging the $87.50 that's around my normal rate but if you normally charge $45.00 that seems excessive.

 

[davedottcom]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

Originally posted by electricmanscott: are we saying that since the work was done horribly by another person and you are redoing the work you are free to overcharge. It seems that for the rough your rate is $87.50 and finish is $45.00. Why the discrepancy? I have no problem charging the $87.50 that's around my normal rate but if you normally charge $45.00 that seems excessive.

For contract work I always get paid for 60% of the entire job after rough wiring is completed... 30% after devices and fixtures... final 10% when is passes the final insp.

It's sort of the same theory! I'm actually making more money to rough wire even though it's not an hourly rate...

Anyway, those rates sound just fine to me.

Dave

 

[iwire]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

Originally posted by electricmanscott:
are we saying that since the work was done horribly by another person and you are redoing the work you are free to overcharge. It seems that for the rough your rate is $87.50 and finish is $45.00. Why the discrepancy?

I do not understand, as long as the customer is aware of the rate ahead of time what's the problem?

 

[bradleyelectric]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

I got a good 1 for you along these lines. My brother called me from Big Blue the other day wanting to know what size wire he needs to wire a new service panel for his house in Richmond. Seems they let him pull a home owner permit to redo the service. This was the first I've heard of it. He's an IT tech, with no electrical experience. He had an inspector come look at what he had done so far and the inspector apparently is having him put a service disconnect ahead of the breaker panel. I've never been to this house.I asked my brother can't he wait till I can come do it for him. He said no the AC guys are coming and there is no room in the fuse panel for the AC and he has a pregnant wife. Around here they would never let someone without a clue pull a permit.

 

[jimwalker]

Re: Why should hire an electrican?

Most states permit the owner to pull permits for there own home.Really should cause no problem as long as it gets inspected.Some places don't really care about licensing at all.Give them the permit fees and they are happy.I was in KY for the 4th,my nephew surprised me,not only in that he is wiring but the inspectors know he did the job under the owners own permit.He is a licensed GC and is not allowed to do plumbing or wiring but does

[ July 10, 2005, 03:56 PM: Message edited by: jimwalker ]