For all you "20 ampers"

[LawnGuyLandSparky]

"How many #12's": As many as I need? I've installed 6 and 8 gang switches with #12. If the box is the right size, I dont have any problem. I'm not following your train of thought here.

deco? How are the art deco switches a problem? If you talking about the old stacked despar switches-I never had a problem. If you are talking about decora switches-never had problems with them either.

While I have scuffed a wall every now and then, I try to be careful. I don't see what the wire size has to do with that.

Because sometimes the heavier guage wire makes it more difficult to drop kick the devices into the box. :grin:

 

[mivey]

Because sometimes the heavier guage wire makes it more difficult to drop kick the devices into the box. :grin:

Research has shown that the more you fram away at the devices, the better they fit:grin:

 

[KentAT]

I'm just curious. I'm not an electrical contractor, but for those of you who are, would you use these new Hubbell SNAPConnect receptacles as a labor saving device or for another reason?

I mean, I've been reading that some say it takes more time to wire a receptacle using 12AWG than it does with 14AWG. Backwire, sidewire, loop around terminal, whatever. With these, whatever size you run to the box gets connected by wirenut to the 12AWG pigtail.

Would this product save enough money in labor to justify using them? Seems like pre-wiring the snap-in pigtail and then later just snapping it into the back of the receptacle would save time and headaches, but at a cost.

http://www.hubbell-wiring.com/Press/PDFS/H5225-SNAPConnect.pdf

My local supply house has these at:
SNAP6R1, solid pigtail = 1.92 (12AWG)
SNAP6R2, stranded pigtail = 1.82 (12AWG)
SNAP5262AL, almond, 5-15R, $6 for a spec grade 15A receptacle
SNAP8200AL, almond, 5-15R, $11.50 for a 15A hospital-grade receptacle

I'm sure contractor pricing would be less...

Thanks
Kent

 

[electricmanscott]

do you upsize your neutral? or are you just a more expensive hack?

Hopefully the most expensive hack.

 

[qcroanoke]

Technically, the size of the decive has no bearing on box fill, only the presence of it.

But of course, some devices take up more space than others. GFIs and dimmers top the list.

My code book says the device counts as two wires.314.16 B 4

 

[iwire]

I'd rather each room have 2 different 15a circuits serving receptacles. Smaller circuits but greater quantity make this easier.

4 15a circuits - 60 a

Ct 1 - 1/2 of livingroom, 1/2 of bedroom1
Ct 2 - 1/2 of bedroom 1 & 1/2 of bedroom 2
Ct 3 - 1/2 of bedroom 2 & 1/2 of bedroom 3
Ct 4 - 1/2 of bedroom 3 & 1/2 of livingroom

3 20a circuits - 60a

Ct 1 - Entire livingroom & 1/2 BR 1
Ct 2 - 1/2 BR 1 & Entire BR 2
Ct 3 - Entrie BR 3

Nice example, a much better design with the 4 15s.

 

[Chamuit]

iwire

Quote: Originally Posted by LawnGuyLandSparky
I'd rather each room have 2 different 15a circuits serving receptacles. Smaller circuits but greater quantity make this easier.

4 15a circuits - 60 a

Ct 1 - 1/2 of livingroom, 1/2 of bedroom1
Ct 2 - 1/2 of bedroom 1 & 1/2 of bedroom 2
Ct 3 - 1/2 of bedroom 2 & 1/2 of bedroom 3
Ct 4 - 1/2 of bedroom 3 & 1/2 of livingroom

3 20a circuits - 60a

Ct 1 - Entire livingroom & 1/2 BR 1
Ct 2 - 1/2 BR 1 & Entire BR 2
Ct 3 - Entrie BR 3

Nice example, a much better design with the 4 15s.

Amen to that! This is what I was trying to say. Thanks for saying it more eloquently!

 

[480sparky]

My code book says the device counts as two wires.314.16 B 4

True, but the size of the device isn't considered. A regular snap switch still counts as two, as well as the biggest, fattest and deepest dimmer.

I've seen dimmers that will not fit into some of the shallower switch boxes that have been installed, even without any wires in them.

 

[geezer]

Depends on if its a IBC (individual branch circuit) or a branch circuit suppling two or more outlets.

I sure missed a lot (this post) in a short amount of time. But to respond to your statement, Quite often it is not an individual branch circuit. Common practice in this area is to include a receptacle for a gas stove on the same circuit. And even without the stove, if a duplex receptacle is installed for the micro/ hood, it might depend on " what your definition of is, is". I know that there has been discussion about duplex receptacles on individual branch circuits.

 

[tryinghard]

"How many #12's": As many as I need? I've installed 6 and 8 gang switches with #12. If the box is the right size, I dont have any problem. I'm not following your train of thought here.

deco? How are the art deco switches a problem? If you talking about the old stacked despar switches-I never had a problem. If you are talking about decora switches-never had problems with them either.

While I have scuffed a wall every now and then, I try to be careful. I don't see what the wire size has to do with that.

I'm asking you specifically how many #12's can/will you install in your 3 gang switch box, counting the switches of course which happen to be deco style?

 

[480sparky]

I'm asking you specifically how many #12's can/will you install in your 3 gang switch box, counting the switches of course which happen to be deco style?

Depends on the in? of your box.....

 

[roger]

I have added a poll to this thread, please vote.

Roger

 

[76nemo]

I've seen entire apartments supplied with one 15 amp circuit. Now that may not be desirable, but I have no problem running 15 amp circuits for living rooms and lighting.

Right now I have a computer, two sound mixers, DSL modem, printer, monitor, speakers, musical keyboard, bass amplifier, DVD player, VCR, cable box, stereo, television, XBox, lamp, and fan on a single 15 amp circuit. I've had them all on at the same time allowing for many people to entertain themselves in various ways and have never had a problem.

I agree with you peter d.

Like to see that level of harmonics. Ever checked that out? That was with 14awg?

 

[roger]

Like to see that level of harmonics. Ever checked that out? That was with 14awg?

Any harmonics would just cancel out in a 120/240 volt residential setting, so there would be no issue at all.

Roger

 

[electricmanscott]

I have added a poll to this thread, please vote.

Roger

The poll does not have an option that I can choose.

Such as... I wire to code and Laugh at those who waste their money on #12 when there is no good reason for it.

 

[76nemo]

Any harmonics would just cancel out in a 120/240 volt residential setting, so there would be no issue at all.

Roger

I meant just that particular circuit Rog..

 

[76nemo]

I see what you're saying.

 

[roger]

I meant just that particular circuit Rog..

It wouldn't matter, that circuit would not see any harmonic effects.

Roger

 

[roger]

I guess I was typing when you posted your last reply.

Roger

 

[George Stolz]

I have added a poll to this thread, please vote.

Roger

You need practice - you gave me a two-option poll that I can vote for both on.